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Unable to add my Amp to the network ...

  • 22 October 2023
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93 replies

Ken_Griffiths

So it’s 

IR—→ PDH—-Boost 1 

Just leave your GES (switch) out of the setup - it’s a just a temporary measure and let all your Sonos devices show up in the Sonos App and then try setting up the Amp via Add Product.

Ken_Griffiths

I thank you very much for trying and doing your best.  I will give Sonos a call.

Before you do give up and walk away, is it possible that you have ALSO wired your GES switch to you IR - in addition to wiring IR to the PDH —my reason for asking is your Apple TV is using the IR wired subnet, rather than the Deco subnet… and that’s causing me some confusion🤔? It’s like something else is wired to your ISP router when in fact things should ALL be wired to your GES (switch).

ratty

Why on earth don’t you just wire the Amp to the second port of the Boost (B1)? It only needs to be a temporary connection. If even that doesn’t allow you to add it to the system there’s something really wrong. 

The OP has actually setup the Amp in the past when wired - it’s when they then try to run it wireless afterwards that he has had issues.. it seems quite clear now that the wired network (as can be seen from the Apple TV screenshot) is a different subnet to the WiFi network SSID "LespeReeves” being used by the iPhone mobile controller device - the user needs to switch their mobile controller devices to connect to the other WiFi  network - sadly it seems they do not know the ‘other’ SSID, or how to access it - I don’t even know myself (yet) if the Deco WiFi and IR WiFi (incorrectly) have the same SSID.

Even when the Amp is setup here and working, it seems to me that the OP’s local network setup will still need looking at in detail, as it seems like it’s in a bit of a mess and certainly split across two subnets.

Well, yes, there’s definitely some uncertainty about how the network is configured, and there are obviously two subnets with different SSIDs. 

I was simply reacting to the fact that the Sonos controller could evidently see the system via a Boost (#1) wired to the primary mesh node. Ergo the Amp ought to be easily addable wired, or even wireless.

On reflection there could also be something odd as a result of the daisy-chain through several switches  and Deco node #2. 

Ken_Griffiths

@ratty,

Thanks for the assistance - I think that there’s certainly an issue with @rlesperance network and it maybe best (much quicker/easier) for @rlesperance to talk things through with the Support Staff over the phone as it’s clear that he has some difficulties making changes to the two routers etc.

I have one quick question though - might the class 4C subnet mask (255.255.252.0) - 1k addresses possibly cause Sonos any issues - I appreciate it’s the same subnet, but was just wondering? I couldn’t test this as my VM/Plume setup does not allow me to change the third octet here? It makes the host address 10 bits rather than the usual 8.🤔

ratty

I have one quick question though - might the class 4C subnet mask (255.255.252.0) - 1k addresses possibly cause Sonos any issues - I appreciate it’s the same subnet, but was just wondering?

Deco evidently chooses to issue /22 addresses, presumably to allow for a plethora of IoT devices. I don’t see how it ought to matter. 

 

R
Userlevel 2
Badge +3

Thanks all for being helpful.

In all my set ups, the only thing I did is connect items together, and let the system arrange itself. I never modified any SSI ID, or IP addresses.

 

As for being unable to have wired and unwired Sonos devices on the network, why is that ?  Do I read in your comments that's it is possible but for some reason in my network it is not or is it impossible to have both at the same time ?

Ken_Griffiths

Thanks all for being helpful.

In all my set ups, the only thing I did is connect items together, and let the system arrange itself. I never modified any SSI ID, or IP addresses.

 

As for being unable to have wired and unwired Sonos devices on the network, why is that ?  Do I read in your comments that's it is possible but for some reason in my network it is not or is it impossible to have both at the same time ?

I’ve never seen a message where a wired device is not allowed - In larger Sonos systems in fact, at one stage, it was sometimes helpful to wire several products to the LAN (just not to Mesh satellite hubs) and it’s not always good practice to wire a Home Theatre Surround, or Sub, to the LAN either where the ‘main’ player is wireless.

I think the issue in your case @rlesperance is the different routers/subnets you have setup and what appears to be a double NAT configuration. I’m guessing you have more than the Deco Primary Hub wired to your ISP provided router too. Sonos Support will hopefully be able to sort it with you a little easier over the phone.🤞

Anyhow… 

@ratty - thanks re the /22 address reply.👍

ratty

Just a few comments:

  • Double NAT is not an issue per se. My system’s behind two routers. (I’ve also run systems in Triple NAT).
  • Being on the wrong side of a secondary router absolutely is an issue, as it would put the controller on the wrong subnet. Sonos controllers need to be on the same subnet as the players.
  • I’ve never ever seen a message telling me I couldn’t wire a Sonos device. And I’ve had a mix of wired and wireless devices for 15+ years.
  • Wiring the second Boost through the Deco satellite might not be a good idea. Some meshes use a flavour of STP (Spanning Tree Protocol) for loop avoidance which could potentially get into a fight with Sonos’ STP variant. If the switches have STP as well things could also get messy.
R
Userlevel 2
Badge +3

Would wiring B1 to my ISP’s modem (so before D1) and not wiring B2, leaving it to connect to B1 trough wifi be an answer to both of your comments ?

ratty

Would wiring B1 to my ISP’s modem (so before D1) and not wiring B2, leaving it to connect to B1 trough wifi be an answer to both of your comments ?

Don’t wire to the ISP box. It’s the wrong side of your primary Deco unit, which by default contains a router.

You could try unwiring B2. That would certainly simplify things somewhat.

R
Userlevel 2
Badge +3

Don’t wire to the ISP box. It’s the wrong side of your primary Deco unit, which by default contains a router.

 

Ratty …  I understand that connecting to my ISP’s router will bypass the D1.  I thought that, by doing this, the Sonos network would not be affected by the Deco discrepancies.  What am I missing ?

 

As for the fact that my Apple TV (ATV) connects to the ISP router (10.0.0.1) instead of the Deco network, I have to add that the ethernet cable in which the ATV is connected originates from D1 before connecting to GES3 in which the ATV connects to (D1 → GES3 → ATV ).  To me that seems to confirm that the ATV is able to decipher what are the available networks and that it is able to choose my ISP’s network instead of Deco’s.

 

Ken_Griffiths

The Boost 2 was initially off a wired Deco Satellite DS-1 from what was mentioned. I did suggest moving it to GES-2, but leaving it uncabled seems sensible. This is what I was seeing from the things mentioned… (if it perhaps helps to clarify things🤔?)… it would be helpful to know if I have the diagram incorrect in any way?

 

Ken_Griffiths

Sorry if the drawing is a bit rough at the edges, but that’s what I was seeing from the things mentioned.

R
Userlevel 2
Badge +3

You are preceding me.  I was in the way of making one.  I don’t have time this morning but I will get back to you.  It will be helpful for everybody.

Ken_Griffiths

My concern is if IR is broadcasting the same SSID as the DPH - particularly as the OP does not know how ‘LespeReeves’ became the SSID name, or indeed if it is the SSID for DPH.🤷‍♂️

Ken_Griffiths

You are preceding me.  I was in the way of making one.  I don’t have time this morning but I will get back to you.  It will be helpful for everybody.

Yes your own diagram will certainly assist - note too I left off your WiFi extender as you mentioned it was now powered off - I’ve assumed that still to be the case.

Knowing/confirming the wireless SSIDs for your two routers would greatly help too.

R
Userlevel 2
Badge +3

The Wifi extender is still powered off.  

 

Where can I see the SSIDs you are talking about ?  I have really no idea about that.

Ken_Griffiths

The Wifi extender is still powered off.  

 

Where can I see the SSIDs you are talking about ?  I have really no idea about that.

It’s the WiFi name(s) that each router broadcasts for its 2.4Ghz band and its 5Ghz band - ideally you need to log onto each router via a web browser (or it’s App) and look at what they are called.

The IR interface is at 10.0.0.1 and I’m guessing the DPH is at 192.168.68.1 —> logon with the admin username and password and look at their configuration pages to get the answers. 

Ken_Griffiths

Note we only need their names and not anything else, like passwords etc.

Whilst in the pages, you may want to note that the 2.4Ghz band needs to be 802.11b/g/n compatible and I suggest perhaps using a security mode of WPA2 AES too for the time being.

ratty

The WiFi’s standards/security aren’t especially relevant as the system’s in SonosNet mode.

 

This however raises a flag.

As for the fact that my Apple TV (ATV) connects to the ISP router (10.0.0.1) instead of the Deco network, I have to add that the ethernet cable in which the ATV is connected originates from D1 before connecting to GES3 in which the ATV connects to (D1 → GES3 → ATV ).  To me that seems to confirm that the ATV is able to decipher what are the available networks and that it is able to choose my ISP’s network instead of Deco’s.

The ATV doesn’t get to ‘choose’. And if the topology is D1 → GES3 → ATV with GES3 on the LAN side of D1 why is it getting a 10.x.x.x IP instead of 192.168.x.x??

It’s beginning to sound as though there are two DHCP servers on the same segment. As if D1 is either being bridged past or is wired incorrectly? 

The topology needs to be documented and thoroughly verified. 

Ken_Griffiths

The WiFi’s standards/security aren’t especially relevant as the system’s in SonosNet mode.

I thought the WiFi backward compatibility was required for device setup - but that’s fair enough. Thanks again.

This however raises a flag.

As for the fact that my Apple TV (ATV) connects to the ISP router (10.0.0.1) instead of the Deco network, I have to add that the ethernet cable in which the ATV is connected originates from D1 before connecting to GES3 in which the ATV connects to (D1 → GES3 → ATV ).  To me that seems to confirm that the ATV is able to decipher what are the available networks and that it is able to choose my ISP’s network instead of Deco’s.

The ATV doesn’t get to ‘choose’. And if the topology is D1 → GES3 → ATV with GES3 on the LAN side of D1 why is it getting a 10.x.x.x IP instead of 192.168.x.x??

It’s beginning to sound as though there are two DHCP servers on the same segment. As if D1 is either being bridged past or is wired incorrectly? 

The topology needs to be documented and thoroughly verified. 

I did wonder (and asked previously) if there was a direct cable link from IR to GES-1 that might be causing that - it’s certainly odd that the Apple TV is cabled to the IR subnet.🤔

Ken_Griffiths

It has made me wonder if the wiring/setup mentioned by the OP is perhaps described incorrectly and that the wired Boost 1 is somehow using the IR subnet too alongside the Apple TV - it’s still a bit of a confused picture, but hopefully a clear ‘detailed’ diagram from @rlesperance later will quickly throw some light on where the problems may lie.

R
Userlevel 2
Badge +3

As a starter ..  see my ISP (Hélix) and Déco configurations by clicking here.  If some sensitive info is displayed, please advise me.

For the network layout, can you tell me where I can find infos on the symbols to use for router, switch, and the like ?

 

Ken_Griffiths

I would maybe take the helix router document down, as it shows it’s password - perhaps edit that out and repost it.

The things that are immediately clear is that some Sonos players are connected to that IR  router - rather than your TP-Link deco router. See attached:

So did you remove the ‘Helix’ SSID from your Sonos App network settings as mentioned in my earlier post.

A diagram/drawing of your network topology would be helpful, if you can still do that.

 

1 Attachment
Ken_Griffiths

In fact on second-glance the Sonos devices are showing as Ethernet connected (via the Boost, I presume?) and getting their IP addresses from the IR router - so the Boost-1 cannot be wired on the LAN side of the PDH (Deco Router)? - We need your diagram to see the full topology of your setup - it’s seems clear something is wrong with how you have the devices wired at the moment.

 

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