New Sonos Connect?


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Have been using Sonos Connect amp into B&W floor standing speakers for 5 years now.For last 2 weeks have been streaming Tidal via a Yamaha WXAD 10 into the Connect line in and have no doubt audio quality is to my ear much improved.Surely the Burr Brown DAC in the Yamaha must be the reason.However the Musiccast app is not great.
You mean Burr Brown is better than Wolfson?:-))

Anything fed into the line in of the Connect gets converted to digital and then back to analog inside the Connect...

Will Tidal not stream via Connect and eliminate a whole lot of components from the signal path that can only be good for it and neutral at worst?
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More than anything the one thing I would like with a new connect is the ability to be able to speed up the signal relative the other sonos elements in a grouping. At the moment there is an issue where the signals are sent to AV receivers and due to processing the synchronization is being lost.
https://en.community.sonos.com/troubleshooting-228999/audio-delay-between-connect-and-play-5-5256084
There are ways round it but the sound in direct mode on most AV receivers isn't very good. This issue has been known about for +5 years surely they could fix this one.
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Well, they could start by making a black connnect! I’m not sure about the better DAC. I’ve actually found that they can mak a difference, but most of the folks who think so likely already have an external DAC. I’m using it as an input to my integrated amp, with a stop in a Schiit DAC on the way. I don’t know what I’d need more outputs for....
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Duncan_16 wrote:

More than anything the one thing I would like with a new connect is the ability to be able to speed up the signal relative the other sonos elements in a grouping. At the moment there is an issue where the signals are sent to AV receivers and due to processing the synchronization is being lost.
https://en.community.sonos.com/troubleshooting-228999/audio-delay-between-connect-and-play-5-5256084
There are ways round it but the sound in direct mode on most AV receivers isn't very good. This issue has been known about for +5 years surely they could fix this one.



Totally agree about this. There are many wonderful sounding AV Receivers, Room Correction devices (preamps etc.) as well as DACs that add some processing to the input. This unfortunately means that when using the sonos connect, the sound will be out of sync with other sonos speakers.

A sync adjustment in the Sonos Connect allowing +/- ms tweaking would be fantastic
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Yiannis74 wrote:

Duncan_16 wrote:

More than anything the one thing I would like with a new connect is the ability to be able to speed up the signal relative the other sonos elements in a grouping. At the moment there is an issue where the signals are sent to AV receivers and due to processing the synchronization is being lost.
https://en.community.sonos.com/troubleshooting-228999/audio-delay-between-connect-and-play-5-5256084
There are ways round it but the sound in direct mode on most AV receivers isn't very good. This issue has been known about for +5 years surely they could fix this one.



Totally agree about this. There are many wonderful sounding AV Receivers, Room Correction devices (preamps etc.) as well as DACs that add some processing to the input. This unfortunately means that when using the sonos connect, the sound will be out of sync with other sonos speakers.

A sync adjustment in the Sonos Connect allowing +/- ms tweaking would be fantastic



Although I could agree on this subject, delay is possible, but not the opposite; maybe they could improve the sync algorithm between speakers to allow less delay than 70msecs.
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camillo777 wrote:

Although I could agree on this subject, delay is possible, but not the opposite; maybe they could improve the sync algorithm between speakers to allow less delay than 70msecs.


In effect what's being requested is the ability to retard the sound coming out of the Sonos devices not connected to the receiver, to allow for the additional delay introduced by the receiver. While I imagine this is technically possible to achieve, I doubt it's a priority for Sonos.

As you probably know, 'improving the sync algorithm' is not really relevant here. Whatever delay Sonos introduces to allow for sync and reliability, the receiver will still be just as out of sync as before.
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pwt wrote:

camillo777 wrote:

Although I could agree on this subject, delay is possible, but not the opposite; maybe they could improve the sync algorithm between speakers to allow less delay than 70msecs.


In effect what's being requested is the ability to retard the sound coming out of the Sonos devices not connected to the receiver, to allow for the additional delay introduced by the receiver. While I imagine this is technically possible to achieve, I doubt it's a priority for Sonos.

As you probably know, 'improving the sync algorithm' is not really relevant here. Whatever delay Sonos introduces to allow for sync and reliability, the receiver will still be just as out of sync as before.



Exactly that. It is certainly technically possible to adjust the 'relative' sync of the connect in relation to other speakers. This would essentially mean adding a sync delay to the rest of the sonos speakers to allow the Connect + AV Receiver to be in sync. Unfortunately I also think this is not a priority for Sonos.
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Yiannis74 wrote:

pwt wrote:

camillo777 wrote:

Although I could agree on this subject, delay is possible, but not the opposite; maybe they could improve the sync algorithm between speakers to allow less delay than 70msecs.


In effect what's being requested is the ability to retard the sound coming out of the Sonos devices not connected to the receiver, to allow for the additional delay introduced by the receiver. While I imagine this is technically possible to achieve, I doubt it's a priority for Sonos.

As you probably know, 'improving the sync algorithm' is not really relevant here. Whatever delay Sonos introduces to allow for sync and reliability, the receiver will still be just as out of sync as before.



Exactly that. It is certainly technically possible to adjust the 'relative' sync of the connect in relation to other speakers. This would essentially mean adding a sync delay to the rest of the sonos speakers to allow the Connect + AV Receiver to be in sync. Unfortunately I also think this is not a priority for Sonos.



Given that this has been in the development request queue for 5 years I would agree that it isn't a priority, however sonos are going to release a new connect and given that there isn't a single AV receiver on the market that can put out 2.1 sound without there being a sync issue. The sonos element is called a connect, you would hope it would connect to and work with pretty much everything.
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Duncan_16 wrote:

Yiannis74 wrote:

pwt wrote:

camillo777 wrote:

Although I could agree on this subject, delay is possible, but not the opposite; maybe they could improve the sync algorithm between speakers to allow less delay than 70msecs.


In effect what's being requested is the ability to retard the sound coming out of the Sonos devices not connected to the receiver, to allow for the additional delay introduced by the receiver. While I imagine this is technically possible to achieve, I doubt it's a priority for Sonos.

As you probably know, 'improving the sync algorithm' is not really relevant here. Whatever delay Sonos introduces to allow for sync and reliability, the receiver will still be just as out of sync as before.



Exactly that. It is certainly technically possible to adjust the 'relative' sync of the connect in relation to other speakers. This would essentially mean adding a sync delay to the rest of the sonos speakers to allow the Connect + AV Receiver to be in sync. Unfortunately I also think this is not a priority for Sonos.



Given that this has been in the development request queue for 5 years I would agree that it isn't a priority, however sonos are going to release a new connect and given that there isn't a single AV receiver on the market that can put out 2.1 sound without there being a sync issue. The sonos element is called a connect, you would hope it would connect to and work with pretty much everything.




Duncan totally agree with you and here's hoping that the new sonos connect will include this feature. I am honestly not very hopeful considering the overall sonos approach to sticking with a limited set of features. We don't even know for sure that a new sonos connect is about to be released. I hope it is but...

Having said that, not many streamers offer this syncing feature. Even the more expensive Bluesound Node 2 does not offer syncing adjustments. Google chrome cast does however and they call it 'group delay correction'.

Still hoping though :-)
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Yiannis74 wrote:

Duncan totally agree with you and here's hoping that the new sonos connect will include this feature. I am honestly not very hopeful considering the overall sonos approach to sticking with a limited set of features. We don't even know for sure that a new sonos connect is about to be released. I hope it is but...


Just to note that this feature -- introducing a configurable, variable delay for selected Sonos devices -- is completely independent of a new CONNECT device, especially as the delay would likely apply to devices other than the CONNECT itself.
jgatie wrote:

Rumor has it there will be a Connect refresh. I highly doubt it will have High Resolution audio like the Bluesound. Sonos has stated in the past they think (as do many other audio experts) higher sample rates are not justified by the math and as such, are not necessary to support.



Sonos is wrong but they also don't want to put in the effort and $$$ to put a decent dac and amp on the Connect. It is ridiculously overpriced and the Node 2 walks all over it easily.
The Connect is without an amp by design, so it means nothing to say that a better amp is needed. The Connect DAC has never been beaten in a controlled double blind test anywhere in the world till now at any price point, inspite of many subjective statements made about it.
DarwinOSX wrote:



Sonos is wrong but they also don't want to put in the effort and $$$ to put a decent dac and amp on the Connect. It is ridiculously overpriced and the Node 2 walks all over it easily.



If "Sonos is wrong", then so is the entire history of physics, biology, and math.
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pwt wrote:

Yiannis74 wrote:

Duncan totally agree with you and here's hoping that the new sonos connect will include this feature. I am honestly not very hopeful considering the overall sonos approach to sticking with a limited set of features. We don't even know for sure that a new sonos connect is about to be released. I hope it is but...


Just to note that this feature -- introducing a configurable, variable delay for selected Sonos devices -- is completely independent of a new CONNECT device, especially as the delay would likely apply to devices other than the CONNECT itself.



Yep it is independent, but given that this is a wish list for a new connect (and only impacts the connect and I guess amp if people are using it like a connect). It would be good if this issue could be addressed at the same time as any new hardware. Personally I have never found the sound quality lacking from the connect, that said if the sync issue was resolved the digital out from the connect could be connected to a different DAC with the appropriate input (using the digital out at the moment give even greater sync issues).
Duncan_16 wrote:



Yep it is independent, but given that this is a wish list for a new connect (and only impacts the connect and I guess amp if people are using it like a connect). It would be good if this issue could be addressed at the same time as any new hardware. Personally I have never found the sound quality lacking from the connect, that said if the sync issue was resolved the digital out from the connect could be connected to a different DAC with the appropriate input (using the digital out at the moment give even greater sync issues).



As the poster stated, the solution would not be handled by the Connect, the solution would require a delay in everything but the Connect. Bottom line is, if Sonos were going to address this, they could have done it a long time ago. So either it is not possible due to a tech issue, or they don't feel it is worth the effort, and most likely a new Connect will not change either of those.
Any more rumors about an updated Connect?

Honestly, the only problems I have with the current device are the dated design and the price. I can’t imagine why the Connect is so much more expensive than a One considering the Connect’s lack of a speaker and other features.
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Sonos updated the Connect last year with a new wireless card (a Mini PCIe card rather than the larger Mini PCI card it used to have, according to pictures from the FCC). It was re-filed with the FCC in March of 2017 and granted at the end of April 2017, so I would imagine it's been in production and on store shelves for at least a few months. If there were any other material changes to the Connect, I think we would have heard about them by now.
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James_154 wrote:

Any more rumors about an updated Connect?

Honestly, the only problems I have with the current device are the dated design and the price. I can’t imagine why the Connect is so much more expensive than a One considering the Connect’s lack of a speaker and other features.



Yes and no. The Connect has a DAC which the One doesn't have, but that surely doesn't reference the full cost. I would imagine much of the cost difference has more to do with market than cost of materials and development. The Connect will effectively bring any analog source and any hi fi amp+speakers into the Sonos system. If the price is too low, the Connect could easily undercut the sales of Sonos other products.
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My thoughts exactly, Sonos is not in the business of selling other folks speakers and I'd guess they only offer the Connect / Connect Amp to lure other brand owners into the Sonos ecosystem. I know that worked for me, here I sit with two fairly high end home theater sound systems and well over 90% of the time I don't make an effort to listen to them (both have Sonos ZonePlayers) over my Play speakers.

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