Wonder how hard it is to rig an HDMI cable with the audio out and ARC pins swapped, and if it would work? In my younger days, I would have the soldering iron out, but my eyes aren’t that great anymore.
Edit: Beat to the punch again.
The optical part of that connection is still limited by bandwidth to Dolby Digital, so the adapter will only be good in getting a Dolby Digital signal to the Arc, and not an a Atmos signal, carried by codecs that can’t be passed by optical.
I’ve posted a few times in this thread and have come back every once in a while to see if any better news has been provided in terms of just plugging in HDMI into the Arc from a split source and having it play audio. If there was a real solution for those of us not using ARC or eARC - I was hopeful Sonos would have clearly stated a solution since the Arc doesn’t have a passthrough. 300+ comments and I’m sure a lot of beta testing prior to the unveiling has shown that some of us are not getting a product worth upgrading from our Playbars. But alas, Sonos seems to be ready to put out a product that people will buy and it will be amazing for some, and a confusing mess for others. It will be boxed up and sent back because of this lack of transparency on how it can and can’t work in a “it should just work” fashion.
I’m 20 Sonos devices in and still love them all. Just disappointed by my own missed expectations - and I’ll own that.
_dave
Does the Arc have any kind of on-screen OSD?
It will likely have a screensaver image, same as the Beam. I haven’t heard an official word from Sonos on this. If if it provided something more than a screensaver, Sonos surely would have advertised it as a feature.
That’s unfortunate. For something as “premium” as the Arc + whatever you get to pair with it from Sonos, it should have some kind of overlay / OSD to show things like volume when you change volume and image format (UHD, Dolby Vision, 4k, 1080p, etc.) of whatever is playing.
I’m still not sure why we need an ARC signal. The optical to hdmi Converter currently sold with the beam gets audio into the beam without generating an ARC signal. It merely transfers the audio data to the ARC audio input pins of the beam.
Surely all we need is a hdmi lead that transposes the the audio data from the standard hdmi pins across to the pins reserved for the ARC Audio on the end that fits into the arc hdmi port ?
ARC is a two way connection between the TV and the AVR / soundbar. It allows the TV to send the audio from connected sources, to the AVR / soundbar so the AVR / soundbar can process that audio. At least that’s how I thought it works. eARC add’s’ a higher bandwidth for that audio the TV is sending to the AVR / soundbar.
Does the Arc have any kind of on-screen OSD?
It will likely have a screensaver image, same as the Beam. I haven’t heard an official word from Sonos on this. If if it provided something more than a screensaver, Sonos surely would have advertised it as a feature.
That’s unfortunate. For something as “premium” as the Arc + whatever you get to pair with it from Sonos, it should have some kind of overlay / OSD to show things like volume when you change volume and image format (UHD, Dolby Vision, 4k, 1080p, etc.) of whatever is playing.
I don’t think you’re quite getting the concept of ARC, either via HDMI or via eARC. It isn’t a standard that’s designed to be in the middle, so it can have its own screensaver. The meaning of the term ARC is Audio Return Channel. Which means the signal goes to the TV first, then gets “returned” back an HDMI cable to the speaker. The speaker isn’t designed to be in the middle, it’s at the end of the chain.
Does the Arc have any kind of on-screen OSD?
It will likely have a screensaver image, same as the Beam. I haven’t heard an official word from Sonos on this. If if it provided something more than a screensaver, Sonos surely would have advertised it as a feature.
That’s unfortunate. For something as “premium” as the Arc + whatever you get to pair with it from Sonos, it should have some kind of overlay / OSD to show things like volume when you change volume and image format (UHD, Dolby Vision, 4k, 1080p, etc.) of whatever is playing.
I don’t think you’re quite getting the concept of ARC, either via HDMI or via eARC. It isn’t a standard that’s designed to be in the middle, so it can have its own screensaver. The meaning of the term ARC is Audio Return Channel. Which means the signal goes to the TV first, then gets “returned” back an HDMI cable to the speaker. The speaker isn’t designed to be in the middle, it’s at the end of the chain.
I understand. I know. Those other sources aren’t directly connected to the ARC like they are a Samsung Q90 or Sennheiser Ambeo so I’m asking too much w/ regards to that. At least some overlay to show volume or audio codec should have been added. Show volume level on-screen when changing volume or if something with Atmos is playing, show that when the piece starts playing. My cheapie Samsung soundbar in the guest room does this.
Ah, then I think I misunderstood you. You mean in the controller device? Since the speaker isn’t in the direct video stream, it would not be able to ‘add’ anything to the HDMI stream being sent to the TV set. And I’m not familiar with any TV that can combine video from two different HDMI ports at the same time.
There’s a lot of things that can be done with pass through devices that can’t with standard ARC devices, it’s true.
I understand. I know. Those other sources aren’t directly connected to the ARC like they are a Samsung Q90 or Sennheiser Ambeo so I’m asking too much w/ regards to that. At least some overlay to show volume or audio codec should have been added. Show volume level on-screen when changing volume or if something with Atmos is playing, show that when the piece starts playing. My cheapie Samsung soundbar in the guest room does this.
But the source for the video isn’t going to be connected to the Arc. How it works is you have the Arc connected to your ARC port, say HDMI #1. Then you connect cable to the TV’s HDMI #2 and a streamer to HDMI #3. You are watching cable via HDMI #1, and you turn up the volume. How is the Arc supposed to display a volume level on HDMI #2 if the Arc is connected to HDMI #1? It would be up to the TV to transpose HDMI #1 over HDMI #2, and no TV I know of can do that.
With respect to the main discussion, will this product be helpful
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07ZTWGBHL/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza
This is what i asked the sellers
“Using a 4k projector(no hdmi-arc), apple tv 4k and thinking of the new sound bar sonos arc(has hdmi arc). how to enable this setup for dolby atmos?”
Here is their answer:
“You can connect the Sonos ARC to output A and your projector to output B and set the EDID to COPY.”
Will have to try to see if it works when we get the Arc
Can anybody tell me if my LG B6 which has ARC will be able to pass through DD+ With Atmos?
I’m wracking my brain how I can get Atmos out of this TV and into the Arc to use it for some of its potential; understating that eARC is needed for TrueHD.
I really don’t want to buy another TV as it could possibly lead to divorce lol. But I have been looking, maybe it’s time to roll the dice.
If my TV cannot pass through DD+ With Atmos, will something like what @Wilker found work? If not anyone interested in a mint 65” LG B6? Haha
But alas, Sonos seems to be ready to put out a product that people will buy and it will be amazing for some, and a confusing mess for others. It will be boxed up and sent back because of this lack of transparency on how it can and can’t work in a “it should just work” fashion.
Is lack of transparency really the issue here? Sonos has stated exactly how there product works, what connection is required, what codecs, and what formats. What that haven’t stated is what your TV and sources are capable of doing, and I’m not sure it’s their job to do so since they don’t own the products.
Understood that an HDMI input, in addition to the HDMI-ARC connection, or separate device or dongle that could convert HDMI audio to HDMI-ARC would be very helpful, but that’s not a lack of transparency issue.
With respect to the main discussion, will this product be helpful
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07ZTWGBHL/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza
This is what i asked the sellers
“Using a 4k projector(no hdmi-arc), apple tv 4k and thinking of the new sound bar sonos arc(has hdmi arc). how to enable this setup for dolby atmos?”
Here is their answer:
“You can connect the Sonos ARC to output A and your projector to output B and set the EDID to COPY.”
Will have to try to see if it works when we get the Arc
I seriously doubt that this device will work, or that the seller really understood the question properly. The Arc can’t take an HDMI input as is suggested. Many soundbars are HDMI-ARC capable...and they have HDMI inputs as well, so his answer is correct in that case. I doubt that the seller understands that ARC/eARC is the only way audio gets to the Arc.
That said, if a device that can extract HDMI audio to HDMI-ARC/eARC, the device above could be rather helpful as a switch in addition to the hypothetical device.
Can anybody tell me if my LG B6 which has ARC will be able to pass through DD+ With Atmos?
I’m wracking my brain how I can get Atmos out of this TV and into the Arc to use it for some of its potential; understating that eARC is needed for TrueHD.
I really don’t want to buy another TV as it could possibly lead to divorce lol. But I have been looking, maybe it’s time to roll the dice.
If my TV cannot pass through DD+ With Atmos, will something like what @Wilker found work? If not anyone interested in a mint 65” LG B6? Haha
I tried to look for the manual, but LG has this odd support site that I keep getting directed to that’s extremely unhelpful. All I really saw was a 3 year old review where people couldn’t agree on whether it worked or not. I would recommend trying to contact LG with this question.
With respect to the main discussion, will this product be helpful
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07ZTWGBHL/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza
This is what i asked the sellers
“Using a 4k projector(no hdmi-arc), apple tv 4k and thinking of the new sound bar sonos arc(has hdmi arc). how to enable this setup for dolby atmos?”
Here is their answer:
“You can connect the Sonos ARC to output A and your projector to output B and set the EDID to COPY.”
Will have to try to see if it works when we get the Arc
I seriously doubt that this device will work, or that the seller really understood the question properly. The Arc can’t take an HDMI input as is suggested. Many soundbars are HDMI-ARC capable...and they have HDMI inputs as well, so his answer is correct in that case. I doubt that the seller understands that ARC/eARC is the only way audio gets to the Arc.
That said, if a device that can extract HDMI audio to HDMI-ARC/eARC, the device above could be rather helpful as a switch in addition to the hypothetical device.
Right; that switch is a slight variation (2 outputs) on the one I have (one output because I didn’t need two) from the same manufacturer. It can’t generate an ARC (or eARC signal). It “supports” ARC because it can pass ARC from an output device (e.g. TV) back to an input device (e.g. receiver).
...
The switch works essentially the same except rather than generating an ARC signal from an input it takes it from the real TV upstream (which is connected to the output of the switch so the TV receives the video and audio from whichever input is active). It then takes that ARC signal and sends it back to a particular input (I think input 4) just like a TV has a specific HDMI port that supports ARC. That way input 4 will always get the returned audio which is useful when the audio is coming from anywhere except port 4. Either generated in the TV itself (e.g. smart apps); or from one of the other HDMI inputs send to the TV as normal HDMI audio; then returned to the switch via ARC which is passed on by the switch to a beam/receiver/whatever on input 4.
Can you verify what you’ve stated in the last paragraph? Specifically that your switch can take the audio coming through one of the HDMI inputs (1,2, or 3), convert it to an ARC signal and send it back along HDMI input 4? If that were the case, this would be rather useful for TVs that are not ARC capable. My understanding was that switches like this would primarily take the audio from inputs 1-4 and send it to the audio output (analog or optical). The ARC feature would, as you stated, take the audio from the HDMI output along the ARC channel and send that to the audio output. I’ve not seen one that can send an ARC signal back along an HDMI input, except perhaps where it’s passed through from the HDMI input. I’ve not seen a device that can generate an ARC signal from an HDMI input.
I did try and research this a bit, looking at the amazon page and the OREI’s product page (looks like they’ve updated the product), but it does not say you can send audio via ARC channels back to an input.
I can’t find an online manual for the switch; but here’s a photo of a similar model that clearly labels input 4 as supporting ARC: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07K6WH9V7/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza?th=1 Mine does the same but isn’t explicitly labeled.
What the switch can’t do alone is HDMI audio input → ARC. What it can do is HDMI audio input → optical out → ARC01 separate device which sends back ARC the switch then distributes to input 4. Problem for Sonos Arc is that the optical is still the weak link. This setup solve the problem of either an device receiving audio that doesn't support optical (or you don’t want to use optical) or specifically a case where you want HDMI for CEC control and such.
Does the Arc have any kind of on-screen OSD?
It will likely have a screensaver image, same as the Beam. I haven’t heard an official word from Sonos on this. If if it provided something more than a screensaver, Sonos surely would have advertised it as a feature.
That’s unfortunate. For something as “premium” as the Arc + whatever you get to pair with it from Sonos, it should have some kind of overlay / OSD to show things like volume when you change volume and image format (UHD, Dolby Vision, 4k, 1080p, etc.) of whatever is playing.
Arc does not display OSD directly, however with ARC/eARC, it will send back the command to the TV to update the volume on the TV. So then the TV will display the volume.
Not sure about the codec. I guess it depend on the TV, on mine, it display resolution and refresh rate when I switch content.
I understand. I know. Those other sources aren’t directly connected to the ARC like they are a Samsung Q90 or Sennheiser Ambeo so I’m asking too much w/ regards to that. At least some overlay to show volume or audio codec should have been added. Show volume level on-screen when changing volume or if something with Atmos is playing, show that when the piece starts playing. My cheapie Samsung soundbar in the guest room does this.
But the source for the video isn’t going to be connected to the Arc. How it works is you have the Arc connected to your ARC port, say HDMI #1. Then you connect cable to the TV’s HDMI #2 and a streamer to HDMI #3. You are watching cable via HDMI #1, and you turn up the volume. How is the Arc supposed to display a volume level on HDMI #2 if the Arc is connected to HDMI #1? It would be up to the TV to transpose HDMI #1 over HDMI #2, and no TV I know of can do that.
edit: I wrote this without reading back the original answers, so this doesn't really add much...
Note that having an AVR with multiple HDMI ins and an HDMI out is a different scenario. Overlaying the OSD is then happening inside the AVR, that simply outputs 1 combined video output to 1 input on the TV. When you are using Audio Return Channel, video is coming into the TV on one input, and the TV sends only the audio out over another input. The soundbar or AVR never sees any video signal and at no point in this process is it involved in adding anything to the video.
So to my understanding, in the use case of Sonos devices, that connect with (e)ARC, this is not something that can be forced by the Sonos hardware.
What your Samsung soundbar likely does, as mentioned above, is tell the TV its status, and the TV will then show a volume control in it's own UI. Similarly, a TV can display the audio format it is receiving on its input or sending over ARC. TVs have been able to do that ever since ARC and CEC were introduced. Nothing to do with the audio hardware though.
Can anybody tell me if my LG B6 which has ARC will be able to pass through DD+ With Atmos?
I’m wracking my brain how I can get Atmos out of this TV and into the Arc to use it for some of its potential; understating that eARC is needed for TrueHD.
I really don’t want to buy another TV as it could possibly lead to divorce lol. But I have been looking, maybe it’s time to roll the dice.
If my TV cannot pass through DD+ With Atmos, will something like what @Wilker found work? If not anyone interested in a mint 65” LG B6? Haha
I’ve got an LG C6 and an Arc on order so I’ll let you know.
The TV will definitely output DD+ (though not Atmos).
Whether it passes through DD+ (with Atmos signals) will be interesting to see.
Keep you posted!
Can anybody tell me if my LG B6 which has ARC will be able to pass through DD+ With Atmos?
I’m wracking my brain how I can get Atmos out of this TV and into the Arc to use it for some of its potential; understating that eARC is needed for TrueHD.
I really don’t want to buy another TV as it could possibly lead to divorce lol. But I have been looking, maybe it’s time to roll the dice.
If my TV cannot pass through DD+ With Atmos, will something like what @Wilker found work? If not anyone interested in a mint 65” LG B6? Haha
I’ve got an LG C6 and an Arc on order so I’ll let you know.
The TV will definitely output DD+ (though not Atmos).
Whether it passes through DD+ (with Atmos signals) will be interesting to see.
Keep you posted!
I'm in a similar position, I've got a 2016 model LG TV with HDMI Arc, have both emailed and spoken with someone from their technical team and neither of them were able to tell me if the TV could pass through the Atmos signal only that it couldn't decode it which I already knew, poor show that a manufacturer can't tell you what their products can do.
I can’t find an online manual for the switch; but here’s a photo of a similar model that clearly labels input 4 as supporting ARC: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07K6WH9V7/ref=ask_ql_qh_dp_hza?th=1 Mine does the same but isn’t explicitly labeled.
Thanks for this. Useful to note.
What the switch can’t do alone is HDMI audio input → ARC. What it can do is HDMI audio input → optical out → ARC01 separate device which sends back ARC the switch then distributes to input 4. Problem for Sonos Arc is that the optical is still the weak link. This setup solve the problem of either an device receiving audio that doesn't support optical (or you don’t want to use optical) or specifically a case where you want HDMI for CEC control and such.
I’m following everything you’re doing here, but I’m not sure what functionality your gaining with CEC. What device on you hoping to gain control over? The TV or one of the input devices? I’m assuming volume isn’t the issue, as that’s typically handled fine over IR. The other areas of control I’ve seen is to have a device turn on/off, or to switch inputs on a TV (which many TVs don’t implement very well from what I’ve seen).
I’m asking more out of curiosity.
That’s unfortunate. For something as “premium” as the Arc + whatever you get to pair with it from Sonos, it should have some kind of overlay / OSD to show things like volume when you change volume and image format (UHD, Dolby Vision, 4k, 1080p, etc.) of whatever is playing.
Arc does not display OSD directly, however with ARC/eARC, it will send back the command to the TV to update the volume on the TV. So then the TV will display the volume.
Actually, I think it’s the other way around. When you send a command to change volume to the TV (via IR remote) the TV displays volume and sends the volume command change to the Beam. If I went to the Sonos app to change the Beam’s volume, the volume is changed, but nothing is displayed on the TV. I believe it will be the same on Sonos Arc. Of course, they could very well be dependent on the TV and how they’ve chosen to implement ARC/eARC.
Sonos should seriously consider creating an HDMI to HDMI-eARC adapter (similar to their optical to HDMI-ARC adapter).
The standard configuration would still be to plug the Arc into the eARC port of a TV, but there are still a lot of TVs sold without an eARC port.
The drawback is that this would encourage more complicated setups and Sonos would likely be involved in tech support, but I think that will happen anyway (at least until eARC is more commonplace).
That’s unfortunate. For something as “premium” as the Arc + whatever you get to pair with it from Sonos, it should have some kind of overlay / OSD to show things like volume when you change volume and image format (UHD, Dolby Vision, 4k, 1080p, etc.) of whatever is playing.
Arc does not display OSD directly, however with ARC/eARC, it will send back the command to the TV to update the volume on the TV. So then the TV will display the volume.
Actually, I think it’s the other way around. When you send a command to change volume to the TV (via IR remote) the TV displays volume and sends the volume command change to the Beam. If I went to the Sonos app to change the Beam’s volume, the volume is changed, but nothing is displayed on the TV. I believe it will be the same on Sonos Arc. Of course, they could very well be dependent on the TV and how they’ve chosen to implement ARC/eARC.
With my Marantz NR1510, when I change the volume, it's actually the NR1510’s OSD that shows the volume change.
My TV is a 2020 model, LG OLED65CXPUA.
That’s unfortunate. For something as “premium” as the Arc + whatever you get to pair with it from Sonos, it should have some kind of overlay / OSD to show things like volume when you change volume and image format (UHD, Dolby Vision, 4k, 1080p, etc.) of whatever is playing.
Arc does not display OSD directly, however with ARC/eARC, it will send back the command to the TV to update the volume on the TV. So then the TV will display the volume.
Actually, I think it’s the other way around. When you send a command to change volume to the TV (via IR remote) the TV displays volume and sends the volume command change to the Beam. If I went to the Sonos app to change the Beam’s volume, the volume is changed, but nothing is displayed on the TV. I believe it will be the same on Sonos Arc. Of course, they could very well be dependent on the TV and how they’ve chosen to implement ARC/eARC.
With my Marantz NR1510, when I change the volume, it's actually the NR1510’s OSD that shows the volume change.
My TV is a 2020 model, LG OLED65CXPUA.
That is different because your AVR is switching the video. It receives video from your source device, adds the volume overlay, and sends it on to the TV.
The Arc never receives any video, so it cannot add overlay info.
If you are using the streaming apps built into your TV, an AVR can’t add a video overlay.
