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Architectura speaker - orientation

  • 26 January 2021
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M
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 i have four architectural speakers that i am planning to hang them facing down from the ceiling - on the rafters of this covered patio. there will be 4 speakers for a total coverage of 330 sq ft (rectangular 12ft x 33 ft ) sized patio. Is this a good orientation for these speakers ?

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Best answer by tracker 28 January 2021, 00:50

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8 replies

T
Userlevel 4
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If you can, @maxpayne, please add details: Though you tagged your post “sonos architectural speakers”, it sounds like the Outdoor Speakers are specifically what you intended?  (But you *did* say both “ceiling” and “rafters”…)  What is the vertical height at the rafters?  With more details, you’ll probably get more sensible responses!

(P.S. 12x33 ft is more like 400 sq.ft. than 330, but presumably you have a non-square layout which led you to say “330”.  Open on 2 sides (L-shaped house wall) or 3?  Details…  If you’re willing to compromise a bit of personal privacy, you could even take a photo!)

T
Userlevel 4
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Apologies, you *did* say “rectangular” 12’x33’.  So one thing you’ll find with overhead speakers (assuming high open rafters, not ceiling) is that stereo is difficult.  You could try Left/Right/Right/Left if you have two gathering loci in the patio, so each table (e.g.) has stereo yet wandering back and forth works because the middle is always Right.  But I would instead run all 4 in mono, especially if they are high up (details?) because otherwise you’ll get a wavering image.  Dividing 33 feet evenly you should actually leave half the distance to the edge of the patio as between each speaker, i.e. 8’ speaker spacing, with 4’ to the edge of the patio at each end.  That’s not awful, but if it were a restaurant they’d want closer spacing so that the volume doesn’t need to be turned up so high, yet still be audible everywhere.  Alas, there isn’t a 6-speaker option for a single Sonos Amp, and 2 zones with 8 speakers total is a little pricey for just “noisemakers on a patio”.  Depending on how high, a typical alternate location that reduces the echoey effect of open rafters with angled ceiling above (details?) is to mount the speakers on the the wall of the house, under the soffits, aimed at an angle down and out.  You get some sound reinforcement, a little bit better bass (nearby, but it really dissipates fast outdoors with no walls), and slightly closer down to people’s ears (so less volume needed) -- but at the price of much lower volume at the 12-foot distance on the opposite edge.  (Personally, I call that a feature, being able to escape the sound system!:-)  At least centered in both dimensions the listener can’t be more than 6’ in one direction and 4’ in the other direction (horizontally) from any speaker.  Good luck, and do take a photo if you’re willing & able!

M
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Thank you for the detailed response here @tracker. The speakers are the sonance outdoor speakers  

I apologize I can’t do math , the length is 33 ft 12 ft depth and 12 ft high (avg) the rafters are a little higher due to the pitch of the roof . My plan was to do the LRRL as you mentioned 

 

AjTrek1
Userlevel 7

Hi @maxpayne 

Nice picture. Great advice from @tracker.

IMO you don’t need 4 speakers to fill the space. In fact you might get complaints from you neighbors.:rolling_eyes:

I’d consider placing a speaker above/center the pillar on the left and above/center the right most window on the right. The speakers would be positioned at a slight downward angle. You could experiment with stereo vs mono.

Edit: Upon close inspection it appears that the area behind the pillar is open as well. You might consider placing the remaining speakers in there. 

Together Everyone Achieves More = T.E.A.M.
melvimbe

If you’re using the Sonance outdoor speakers sold on this site, you can actually use 3 pair of speakers with a single Amp.  

 

The other point I would make is considering where you think people will be located under the deck.  If, for example, you were planning on putting a seating area or dining table on the right side, with nothing on the left, then may a pair of speakers focused on that area with nothing on the left.   Or perhaps you anticipate people will be out in the yard often, so speakers pointing there would be smart.

I guess I have one more point.  Sound will travel in the direction of the speakers, so if you are concerned  about volume for neighbors don’t point speakers in their direction.  You can have speakers out in the yard pointing in towards the house.

Danny
M
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Thank you @AjTrek1@melvimbe for the tips here
i was really hoping that two on either sides (stereo)  or middle two posts (stereo or mono)  would cover the entire area , but i already purchased the 4. it was a great price for 4 to pass it up.

I forgot to mention this is the connect amp and not new amp, so i wont be able to use the 6.

T
Userlevel 4
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  1. Yep, @melvimbe is right: 3 pair of speakers are allowed per Amp, if they are the Sonos/Sonance co-branded ones.  I don’t think I would try more than 2 pair of most normal speakers, the combined impedance would get too low.  (It makes one wonder if the Amp is doing some kind of adaptive bass throttling if it knows or can count how many of its own-brand speakers are attached.  Or maybe it always has ABL running but we usually don’t notice because it doesn’t kick in?) [Edit crossing posts; Connect:Amp, not new Amp, gotcha.]
  2. I respectfully disagree with @AjTrek1 that 4 speakers is too many: Sure, if you turn them all up, the neighbors may complain -- but the point of having 4 instead of 2 is to allow a lower volume setting and more even coverage rather than shouting at people nearby, in order to be heard at all, out at the edge of the patio. 
  3.  @melvimbe is also right that a typical pro installation of garden speakers will have several small “spotlight” speakers pointed back at the house, either in an even blanket or at specific areas around the patio, so forget my idea about soffit-mounting and angling out.  But pointing your larger outdoor speakers down at the floor as you intended is a perfectly fine way to prevent the sound from being directed to the neighbors.  (Besides, it’s much easier to pull/hide wire over the rafters than make multiple holes through the siding.  The denser your crowd, the less the reflection from the floor too!-)
  4. A typical pro installation of overhead restaurant or bar speakers will do one more trick that you might consider, but only afterwards, if you don’t like the coverage you get from 4 speakers @12’H. or you get weird effects from sound bouncing off the roof (which must be pretty close to the rafters): Attach down-rods to put the speakers 3 feet closer to the ears.  They look like ceiling fan extension rods.  Go into any chain restaurant that has been “installed” into generic open high-ceiling shopping mall space or outbuilding and you’ll see what it’s like.
  5. I imagined that the space behind that column on the left (is there a fireplace on the other side, or is it just a storage closet?) will be served with sound by the interior rooms if the patio is in use, so no reason to change from your planned overhead coverage, unless you’re going to have special uses for the two areas.  Even if not, the idea that there is some “escape” from the sound system still appeals to me.
  6. Finally, and definitely off topic, @maxpayne your photo shows a gray stain on that column.  Maybe you simply had a barbecue grill outside there since the house was built.  But if not, you might want to check for water infiltration or a firebox backside too close to the sheathing, or *something* responsible.
M
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Thank you @tracker  for the details here

the space behind the column is a fireplace. i have plans to add speakers there as well, wish i had purchased an Amp and not a Connect:Amp , could have done with 6 speakers across these two areas with one Amp.

the previous owner left a bbq right against that column causing the stain, i just need to repaint it

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