Successful 12 volt trigger with adequate delay


Userlevel 1
I was not too sure where to post this. 12 volt trigger threads seemed old so I started a new one.

Context: ZP90 hooked to a Rotel power amp. I want Rotel to go on standby when no music is played. I read multiple threads and the consensus seems to be that this type of integration is either costly or not reliable due to extended silence between tracks in some records.

Here is what I did:

Parts:
Xantech Current sensing block CSM1
Xantech Power supply 781RG
Xantech Audio Sensor Module SMAUD01
Altronix 6062 Multipurpose timer

Total Canadian landed cost $110

I originally installed the Xantech components only. So when music was sensed, a 12 volt trigger would fire to the rotel amp. I quickly found the solution to be unusable as the Xantech timer is only 15 seconds and probably less and therefore the amp would trigger on-off multiple times either at end of a track or during silent parts of classical music.

I then added the Altronix timer. This is where it came all together.

When audio is sensed, Xantech send the 12 volt trigger to the Altronix, The Altronix send the 12 volt trigger to the Amp. I set the Altronix to 60 minutes delay so I need complete silence for 60 minutes before the Altronix releases the 12 volt signal. Now setting of the DIP switches is key here:

You want DIPs
1 OFF
2 OFF
3 ON
4 ON

With the DIP switches set that way, it ensure that :

1-Altronix energizes 12 volt as soon as it receives the 12 volt trigger from Xantech. In other words at start of timming cycle
2-Timer is set in minutes not seconds
3-Operating voltage is 12 volt not 24
4-Timing starts after the removal of trigger input. **this one is critical**

DIP switch 1 and 4 are key here: they will ensure that amp Altronix sends a 12 volt trigger as soon as audio is sensed AND DIP 4 plays a timer reset role. When music stops in between track and restarts, this restarts the timer for a new 60 minutes without releasing the 12 volt trigger.


Wiring.


Xantech power supply feeds the Xantech Current sensing block. Xantech current block has + and -. I used those to feed the + and - of Altronix

I plugged a wire between the Xantech current sensing block
"pull up" to the "TRG" of the Altronix

Plugged a wire from Altronix "+" to Altronix "C"

The wire pair going from the Altronix to the Rotel 3.5mm 12volt trigger has the negative to the "-" and the positive to the "NO"

I highly encourage that you try this with a multimeter first, you do not want to fry your amp. Once everything is working well offline then you may integrate

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26 replies

I've moved your post as the solution you describe hardly fits in Sound Ideas as a feature request.

For reference 12V triggers are mentioned in these threads:
http://forums.sonos.com/showthread.php?t=62
http://forums.sonos.com/showthread.php?t=16545
Userlevel 2
A special thanks to upgradealways for the 12V trigger solution. I used the same parts list plus a $5 project box from Radio Shack (which the Altronix mounted in perfectly) and ended up spending about US $120 from a place called J Mac.

Our setup: we have a set of in ceiling speakers that do double duty: Sonos music by day, rear surround speakers for our home theater by night. The Sonos is routed through a Russound amplifier because we're driving 8-75W speakers off of it. During the day, we tend to play Sonos relatively softly for background music, so volume activated solutions like the Niles ABS1 (which we tried tinkering with for several months) don't work well. Even the max trigger delay was simply not long enough; the Niles kept switching back and forth between the two sources and drove my husband nuts.

We are now using the 12V trigger solution described by upgradealways to both power on and off the Russound amplifier and switch between the two sources. The adjustment on the Altronix is nice; we set the trigger delay to about 10 minutes, which prevents virtually all accidental shutoffs due to low volume, but gives a reasonable amount of time to get set up for a movie on the home theater.
Userlevel 2
I have an emotiva upa-200 that I was always having to manually take on and off standby, but with this tip, I got the triggers working and it is great! Although, I am not much to know how to connect things, so figuring out how to connect the pull up and pull down connections was a bit of a pain. I ended up cutting off one end of the mini jack that the amp came with for the trigger. For those that are like me and had not much clue what to do, the red wire goes in the pull up, black goes in pull down, and the remaining wire goes into ground. My altronix timer is currently on order and I'll have it installed this week. This was a great tip and I love that I can now trigger my amp when I get sound output!
Userlevel 2
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Any idea what would be needed to apply this to a multi channel amp. For example, a Rotel 1048 amp with 8 channels (4 Connects to each input) so that when a signal is detected from any of the 4 connects, the amp powers on (and off after no signal given the timer delay). Thanks
Userlevel 2
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Rather 1 connect to each of 4 source inputs...
Userlevel 2
Badge
Maybe something like this: 8-Way RCA Composite Video and Stereo Audio Splitter
Userlevel 2
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Thanks for the info. Questions: Does the Audio Sensor Module piggyback off one of the audio outs from the connect and go to the CSM current sensing block input? For the 12 volt trigger, do you remove the AC plug an connect the 3.5mm to the 12 volt amp input and the other ends to the timer? Thanks
Userlevel 2
It took me forever to finally get around to hooking up the altronix timer, but now that I have, I was wondering if anyone hears the timer ticking through the speakers too. My jumpers wrong?

I know this is an old thread, but thought I'd give it a try.

Also, yes, the audio sensor has an adaptor that goes between the speaker connect and the amp.
Userlevel 1
It took me forever to finally get around to hooking up the altronix timer, but now that I have, I was wondering if anyone hears the timer ticking through the speakers too. My jumpers wrong?

I know this is an old thread, but thought I'd give it a try.

Also, yes, the audio sensor has an adaptor that goes between the speaker connect and the amp.



I did the test this morning out of curiosity and I cannot hear the timer.
Test one: listen to music at casual level and see if I hear timer, I can t.

Test two: stop music and got my ear really close to the speaker, specifically near the tweeter. I could not hear the timer click neither. Disclaimer, I was not in a 100% silent room set-up , some windows were open so I would say I had a 30db background noise from regular surrounding noise.

I don t use the zone quite often but when I do, it is more for critical listening. I would have caught hearing a timer had this been the case. I am wondering if one of the module is defective or if this is some sort of ground loop issue.
Userlevel 2
I am just setting up this Xantech / Altronix solution for a ZP90 trigger but hit a snag with the Altronix timer. It would seem that the jumper J3 needs to be cut to get the timer to operate correctly. With J3 in place the timer defaults to running the timer on power up (regardless of signal on TRG) and as a result of the advised dip switch settings, the Altronix switches the output to on. Any one have this problem ?
Userlevel 2
Further to my earlier above post I would just like to comment that the J3 jumper needs to be cut on the Altronix 6062 to enable correct operation.
My final setup is as per UPGRADEALWAYS Xantech & Altronix components but using Elan Audio Sensor as the Xantech audio sensor is currently discontinued.
As additional comment the Elan sensor works opposite to Xantech and as such the PULL DOWN contact needs to be used on the CBCSM1. I have set the Elan to max sensitivity and this then switches when the volume is set to 25% and audio is playing on the Connect.
As a matter of interest I use the above Connect "12V trigger" signal to switch a relay which turns on / off 2 x 400W RMS Alto powered speakers + mixer.
I can provide a drawing or further information if anyone is interested.
Userlevel 2
Just a note of thanks to UPGRADEALWAYS. The trigger is working well, no clicking noises. THANKS
Userlevel 1
Just a note of thanks to UPGRADEALWAYS. The trigger is working well, no clicking noises. THANKS

Cool I m glad it works !
Userlevel 2
Hello upgradealway. I just bought the Sonos Connect Amp and I’m bit of an electronics novice as you will soon see below. Can you please take a look and let me know if this follows your instructions exactly? Thanks …

Buy:
Xantech Current sensing block CBCSM1
Xantech Power supply 781RG
Xantech Audio Sensor Module SMAUD01
Altronix 6062 Multipurpose timer

Set DIPs:
1 OFF, 2 OFF, 3 ON, 4 ON

Wiring:
[Using CAT-6 wire for everything]
Xantech “+12VDC” to Altronix “+”
Xantech “GND” to Altronix “-“ (not sure if this is correct)
Xantech “Pull Up” to Altronix “TRG”
Altronix “+” to Altronix “C”
Altronix “-“ to Amp “GND” (not sure if this is correct)
Altronix “NO” to Amp “12V” (not sure if this is correct)
Userlevel 2
I addressed this to upgradealways, but maybe someone else can help.

When upgradealways said in the wiring instructions that "Xantech current block has + and -. I used those to feed the + and - of Altronix".

The Xantech has four inputs, 12vDC, GND, Pull Up, and Pull Down. Can I assume 12vDC is the "+" and GND is the '-'?

I apologize in advance for the potentially stupid question.
JohnL22a,

"GND", "Ground", and "-" usually mean the negative power supply connection. As does the
code:
  | 
|
-----
---
-

symbol.

"+", "PWR", or a specific voltage such as "+12VDC", usually imply the positive power supply connection. However, a "+12VDC" terminal could also be some sort of output provided by the box. Offshore companies are often language challenged while writing instructions and labeling terminals.

In any case, your wiring diagram is correct -- assuming that the "12V" terminal on the amplifier is its "12V Trigger" input.

Which model amplifier are you using?
Userlevel 2
Thanks for the help buzz. I appreciate it.

My amp is a Parasound with two connections; +12V and GND. It looks like based on upgradealways initial wiring instructions and your help, I should hook the amp up as follows:
Altronix “-“ to Amp “GND”
Altronix “NO” to Amp “+12V”

Makes sense?
JohnL22a,

Yes, as long as that "12V" terminal is a control input.
Userlevel 2
hello all:

i'm using two Sonos Amps, a speaker splitter and one Dayton SA230 sub amp to power an in-wall sub.

is is possible to make a connection to the Dayton's 12v trigger so that when i use sonos the DAyton amp switches on?

would an Elan Audio Sensor work? how would i connect the audio jack to the 12v trigger?

thanks
leib,

First post! Welcome to the forums.

You don't need any external equipment or additional connections. Set the Dayton SA230's "REMOTE TURN ON" to "Auto".
Userlevel 2
How about using Speakercraft LL-One and use the status out to trigger the Power amp?
avidsystems,

I have no experience with this unit, but I expect that it would work. As always, there may be low level detection challenges.
Badge
This sounds just like what I need and an inventive solution!

Could someone please take some pics of one of these functioning installs? Once I see circuit boards, I get less comfortable I'll know how to do it, but I want to do something just like this to power my patio's Crown CDi1000 amp which is connected to a dedicated APC H15 that has DC trigger in.
I don't understand why Sonos does not intergrate a 12v trigger into their sonos connect. Sorry, but I am not an electronic engineer !!
They did that by making the Connect Amp! As a bonus they threw in an amp as well.