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Play:1 missing in S2 app, visible in Controller App....


Hi,

Have been experimenting to try and understand/resolve the nature of this problem but not able to, so need some help if possible!

Have 3 x Play:1s, recently noticed that only a single Play:1 was visible in Mobile App (S2 on Android, Samsung S21). However, I have found that all 3 are visible in Controller App on Windows 10.

The speaker that was visible was connected to a BT Smart Disc Extender. If I ensure the mobile phone is connected to the Extender, it doesnt have any impact. If I disconnect the Extender, the speaker disappears completely and Sonos reports no active speakers. However, all 3 remain active in Sonos Controller App on Windows 10.

If I connect one Speaker to the router directly via Ethernet, with the Extender still turned off, all speakers come up and are visible in both the Controller App and the S2 app on Mobile.

If I then remove the Ethernet cable, the speakers remain connected and visible in both apps for a short period but eventually they all disappear from the Sonos S2 app, but remain visible in the Controller app. All speakers show as connected directly to the Router when checking the router config- I therefore dont think its a connectivity issue for the speakers themselves but more about visibility?

 

I initially thought the issue was related to the Disc Extender, since this is the speaker that generally remained visible whilst the other two, connected to the main router, disappeared. However, if I eliminate the Extender, then all of the speakers disappear from the S2 app which would seem to indicate that the issue is with the Router rather than the Extender. Equally, I do not get any issue with the Controller App, in any circumstance, which would seem to indicate the issue is a device issue rather than a Router issue?

Both devices, laptop and mobile, are connected to the Router via 5Ghz.

I suspect if I move all 3 speakers nearest to the Extender, so that they are all connected to that, then perhaps all 3 will be visible in both the S2 app and the Windows Controller app- however, I see little purpose in doing that, as I dont want the speakers located together permanently and I cant force the Sonos speakers to only connect to the Extender rather than the Router.

Any suggestions or ideas I can try?

My workaround may be that I leave one speaker permanently connected via Ethernet to the Router.

 

 

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Best answer by Corry P 9 April 2021, 10:48

Hi @arattray 

Ah. The new Private Address feature in iOS! Yes, this has been causing problems for some. There’s a thread about it here: 

I believe a reset or reinstall of the Sonos app, followed by reconnecting it to Sonos (with the Private Address feature active) will solve the issue.

It’s not confirmed, but I believe the change of the phone’s MAC address since the first connection of the app makes your Sonos system mistrust it.

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HI @arattray 

Welcome to the Sonos Community!

This is almost certainly due to your extender - in fact, it’s exactly why we don’t support the use of extenders as they typically don’t do a very good job of what they claim to do. If your computer were to connect to the network via the same extender, you’d likely have the phone issues on the computer too. In other words, Sonos can have just as many problems if your controller device connects to the extender instead of/as well as the speaker

Connecting a speaker to ethernet will typically make all your Sonos devices use their own WiFi network, created by the wired device and repeated by any that pick it up. Thus, Sonos may actually get better coverage than your router and extender combined. If this produces the best results, then I recommend you do this.

As you clearly need an extender for other devices, however, I recommend you replace it with a mesh system as these are much more robust. If you do this, it will be important to tell the mesh to work in Bridge mode (just Google the mesh name and “bridge mode” and you’ll find instructions). The disadvantage of meshes is that they’re a good bit more expensive than an extender, typically starting at the £170ish mark. I would recommend you avoid Google Mesh as they can be difficult to put into Bridge mode.

It may be worth rebooting the router - I recommend you do this several times a year even if you’re not having any issues, especially with those that come for free from your provider.

This is all general advice - you will get more specific advice if you give our technical support team a call as they have tools at their disposal that will allow them to gain a better picture of what your system needs.

Hi,

Thank you for the response. Unfortunately, I dont think it addresses the root cause of the issue and after some further investigation today, I have found the solution.

As I mentioned in my original post, when the Extender is turned off and all connectivity is via the router, the Mobile S2 app still couldnt connect, whereas the Controller app on Win10 had no issues connecting to all speakers. This suggests that the Extender isnt the issue.

To demonstrate this point further, I connected the Windows 10 laptop to the extender and the Controller app continued to display all speakers.

I tried connecting with additional devices and discovered that an Android tablet was able to see all speakers, whereas an iPad could only see the speakers connected to the Extender.

Looking at how each of the devices were connected to the router, it was apparent that the two non-working devices use “randomised MAC addresses”. Adjusting these to use the device MAC address resolved the problem.

Therefore, I think the Extender is actually the device which is working correctly- a Sonos speaker connected to it is able to communicate with a device using either a randomised MAC address for privacy/security, or a device using standard in-built MAC address.

Any speaker connected to the Router however is only able to communicate with devices which are using standard in-built MAC address. It will not communicate with any device using randomised MAC address.

Setting the devices to use their own MAC address is a workaround, although I am happy to leave as is, since it is an internal network so privacy issues are less. However, I think this suggests there is a setting I need to enable in the Router to allow Sonos to communicate with these devices correctly?

I have had no other connectivity issues with other devices using this router, this limitation only seems to affect Sonos.

Thank you for any help!

Userlevel 5
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Hi @arattray 

Ah. The new Private Address feature in iOS! Yes, this has been causing problems for some. There’s a thread about it here: 

I believe a reset or reinstall of the Sonos app, followed by reconnecting it to Sonos (with the Private Address feature active) will solve the issue.

It’s not confirmed, but I believe the change of the phone’s MAC address since the first connection of the app makes your Sonos system mistrust it.

FWIW Samsung also by default uses a randomised MAC. You can change it to use the device MAC in the WiFi advanced settings for the SSID in question.

Moreover some extenders mangle the MAC address of attached clients, substituting their own OUI (Organizationally Unique Identifier) for the first 3 octets, as seen from the rest of the network. Since this ‘virtual MAC’ differs from the real MAC visible when the station moves upstream of the extender, IPs could change and/or ARP fail when it roams between the two sides of the extender.

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Moreover some extenders mangle the MAC address of attached clients, substituting their own OUI (Organizationally Unique Identifier) for the first 3 octets, as seen from the rest of the network. Since this ‘virtual MAC’ differs from the real MAC visible when the station moves upstream of the extender, IPs could change and/or ARP fail when it roams between the two sides of the extender.

Thanks - I thought something like that might be going on, as the extender was making a difference.

Just as an update, as of this evening, the behaviour returned to previous on the Samsung S21 phone through the S2 app- it can only see the speaker that is connected to the Extender, it cannot see the other two which are connected to the Router. Regardless of whether the S21 is connected to either device.

Yet, the iPad remained with no issues and has visibility of all speakers.

So, I am really not sure what is going on, but rebooting the router has fixed it. Will see how long for.

Is the Sonos system visible on the Samsung phone and on the iPad when you disconnect the extender?

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