65,000 track workarounds -- confused

  • 13 December 2010
  • 32 replies
  • 15109 views

Hi all,

Sorry to start a new thread, but am in need of basic answers:

I spent last night reading every thread I could find wrt workarounds on the 65K track limit.

Frankly, most of it was over my head, technically speaking.

But here's what I gleaned...

1) there is some kind of beta-type solution where something emulates a WMP server. But apparently it doesn't work with FLAC or ALAC, which is a dealbreaker for me.

2) Spoon/dbPA had some success with Asset, but I gather this now only works with the Desktop Controller? And it might 'break' when Sonos next updates the DC, which one would think is coming soon.

Am I right so far?

I own a Netgear ReadyNAS NVX NAS, but I gather this NAS is incompatible with the dbPA solution as it's not a Windows server/WHM product?

I also own a Buffalo NAS:

http://www.amazon.com/Buffalo-Technology-LinkStation-Performance-LS-V2-0TL/dp/B0042TW3J6/ref=dp_ob_title_ce

Would the Buff be compatible with the dbPA solution?

Any other solutions I'm missing?

Thanks, John

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32 replies

i have an ARCAM Hifi which has it's own app. input : Nas - output : Sono's no limits ...cheeky but it works 🙂
Since the vast majority of users are either streaming or will never hit the 65K limit in a lifetime, I doubt that this is a high priority for more than a (highly vocal) 0.1% of them.

As it would obsolete some older hardware to up the limit, it's unlikely to happen anytime soon, even if you hold your breath until you turn blue.
To all users experiencing the track limitation issue:
Can I suggest that you post to Sonos on their facebook site EVERY SINGLE TIME they post about a new feature or product
I feel that is the only way we 'MAY' see some sort of resolution

We need to let the public know more about this issue and keep the public pressure on Sonos to fix this damn problem
Please, each and every one of your voices is important
We need to get this issue resolved
I feel like Im the only old man on the corner shaking his fist at the skateboarders doing kick flips off my front fence
WE NEED TO UNITE & BE HEARD!
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cappersg,

This is a minor point, but I want to prevent any misunderstandings.

In computers there is some confusion when we express numbers near a power of two or ten.

The shorthand number "1K" can mean 1000 (a power of 10) or 1024 (a power of two). In the case of "64K", if we assume that this is a binary number, its decimal value will be 65536 and we sometimes will express this as "65K". Further, in some computer hardware, the maximum positive number is 65535. This leads to numerous misunderstandings.

In the case of the SONOS library, the limit is exactly 65000 tracks -- a decimal number.


The limit may be up to 65,000 tracks depending on your tags. If you tend to include a lot of info in your tags, you can top out well below 65,000. We've had people here not get past 45,000
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Hi Guys, I'm completely new to SONOS, as in less than a week! I bought a play 5 and 2 x play 3's at the weekend and saw this thing about 65'000 song limit.

I've been a DJ and radio presenter for over 20 years so i LOVE music and 65'000 is surely enough for most people isn't it?

i suppose the only problem comes when like me you are importing two peoples music collections, I have around 35'000 tracks on mine so far and the other has 10'000 so I'm guessing it could become an issue in the future but sonos may have sorted it by then.


If you have 45,000 total tracks, you may still be in trouble depending how your tags are structured. The 65,000 limit is for minimal amounts of tag usage.
You can't attach images to private messages on the forum, but if you can find somewhere to upload your screen grabs you can always post (or PM) a link.

X: is presumably an external drive.

Which folder is shared onto the network? Presumably not the root folder (X:\) otherwise Sonos would be indexing your 'Peter Gabriel' tracks already.

You will need to have one folder shared which you do want Sonos to index ('sonos def'?) and one folder shared which you do not want Sonos to index.

Let's suppose that you make a top-level folder on X: called 'X:\sonos unshared\'. You would share this onto the network under the name "sonosunshared" (say). You would then move the 'Peter Gabriel' folder into it.

Your M3U file should look like:
\\sonosunshared\Peter Gabriel\Half Blood-FLAC16\01. The Rhythm of the Heat.flac
\\sonosunshared\Peter Gabriel\Half Blood-FLAC16\02. San Jacinto.flac
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X:\sonos def\pre sonos\J.S. Bach Actus tragicus\(01) [Philippe Pierlot - Ricercar Consort] Gleichwie der Regen und Schnee vom Himmel fallt BWV 18- Sinfonia.aiff
X:\sonos def\pre sonos\J.S. Bach Actus tragicus\(02) [Philippe Pierlot - Ricercar Consort] Recitativo.aiff

these are working because they are in the dedicated folder

X:\Peter Gabriel\Half Blood-FLAC16\01. The Rhythm of the Heat.flac
X:\Peter Gabriel\Half Blood-FLAC16\02. San Jacinto.flac

these are not working

could i send you an im because i made some screen prints pertaining to this question

rob bijpost
robbijpost,

Just post an example of a few lines from the M3U file you're attempting to use.
Userlevel 2
dear buzz or someone else in this forum

can i send you an im with screenprints, your colleagues at sonos netherlands say it cannot be done.

I on the other hand want to believe you and the forum, but the question is how can sonos be told through the exact same playlists, where it should find the music files.

thank you for bearing with me

rob bijposst
robbijpost,

By "shared folder" we mean telling the operating system that the respective folder can be accessed by any computer on the network that has proper credentials. By "credentials" I mean that some folders may be protected with a user name and password. In this case the owning computer will not allow the share without proper credentials.

Once a folder or group of folders are "shared", any or all of these folders can be included in your SONOS music library setup. Any folders declared in the SONOS library will be indexed and become your SONOS Music Library.

SONOS playlists will always be tracks from the SONOS Music Library.

An "Imported Playlist" is simply a list of files. This list is typically prepared by a program, such as Media Monkey, however, playlists are simple enough that one could use a text editor to build a playlist. As long as SONOS can fetch the file (and, the file is a supported format) the file will play, regardless of being in the SONOS library or not. If the file is in a folder that is not shared or SONOS does not have the proper credentials, the attempt to play will fail.

iTunes playlists are different because a specific file, prepared by the iTunes program, is imported.

Also, make sure that the computer or hard drive storing the file is turned and not sleeping at the time you want to play the track.
Userlevel 2
I read in the forums quitwe often abot elling or not telling sonos to index

I am confused about what this means in a procedural way.

I only see update music index overall

if you would be so kind as to elaborate i would be grateful

kind regards

rob bijpost
then i made another playlist of same folder but then in not indexed part of same hd.
the playlist was indexed and showed the constituting files, but did not play the files.

You still need to share the unindexed folder onto the network. You just don't tell Sonos to index it.

Each line in the playlist should be of the form:
\\devicename\sharename\subfolder\ .... \subfolder\trackfilename

1/ Each music file reference must be an absolute UNC path
2/ Sonos must have read access to the unindexed share
Userlevel 2
dear buzz

I tried the workaround, made a playlist of a folder with files.
first the playlist manifested in the folder on my external hd and when indexed it played the files, which were also indexed because they were in the same disk, same lower order folder.
then i made another playlist of same folder but then in not indexed part of same hd.
the playlist was indexed and showed the constituting files, but did not play the files.

colud you please help me

rob bijpost
cappersg,

This is a minor point, but I want to prevent any misunderstandings.

In computers there is some confusion when we express numbers near a power of two or ten.

The shorthand number "1K" can mean 1000 (a power of 10) or 1024 (a power of two). In the case of "64K", if we assume that this is a binary number, its decimal value will be 65536 and we sometimes will express this as "65K". Further, in some computer hardware, the maximum positive number is 65535. This leads to numerous misunderstandings.

In the case of the SONOS library, the limit is exactly 65000 tracks -- a decimal number.
Userlevel 2
@chilly: maybe a DJ and presenter has learned to select music - and delete the rest 🙂.

We normal listeners like @Thomas and @ianmacd and myself- collect a lot and don't want to remove the "lesser" songs. After years of collecting and digitizing 3000 albums you may reach 64000.....

But this discussion makes me think. Maybe SONOS is telling us something? Make up your mind? Make choices - just like in real life;) ! SONOS as a mindgame! For free! Food for thought.

But if you want to exceed the 64000 anyway there are ways enough mentioned in this thread!
Userlevel 2

How do some of you other hunter-gatherers manage to collect so much? ;)


Easy. Some of us spend a lot of money on music... ...and some of us don't. 🙂
I've been a DJ and radio presenter for over 20 years...


...and still you don't run into the track limit yet?

How do some of you other hunter-gatherers manage to collect so much? 😉
Userlevel 2
Hi Guys, I'm completely new to SONOS, as in less than a week! I bought a play 5 and 2 x play 3's at the weekend and saw this thing about 65'000 song limit.

I've been a DJ and radio presenter for over 20 years so i LOVE music and 65'000 is surely enough for most people isn't it?

i suppose the only problem comes when like me you are importing two peoples music collections, I have around 35'000 tracks on mine so far and the other has 10'000 so I'm guessing it could become an issue in the future but sonos may have sorted it by then.
Userlevel 2
@Robbijpost:
  • the m3u files should be in the directory SONOS is scanning for the index.
  • The actual music files shoul be in another directory of course 🙂.


BUT: make sure the playlist uses a correct path to the files!
For example:
  • the standard SONOS directory structure is like ....server/music/album/files 1-nn.mp3
  • and the actual playlist files are in the not searched location ....server/playlists/group/files1-nn.mp3

Make sure the playlist is somewhere in ....server/music/ and the actual playlist directs to ....server/playlists/ etc....
Userlevel 2
I just now read your reply.

it could be most helpfull

but can you plse enlighten

where should the m3u file be and whre should the mp3 files be

I see the m3u and put it in my sonos folder
it indexes, but will not play

thanks in advance

rob bijpost
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I use M3U4U and create playlists which Sonos then indexes as tracks, so the Sonos can now cope with 65000 folders. You need to make the track name the file name and only get coverart on the Now Playing window. Almost as good.....
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is there a manual as how to implement it on a mac on OsX 10.7


There's a readme document in the root folder of the download, it explains how to install:

https://github.com/henkelis/sonospy/blob/unstable/README

The install is actually just a copy, plus opening a few ports if you have a firewall running on the machine. You just need Python (which should already be installed on your Mac) to run it.

Once you've installed, then it's just a scan of your music before you start the server.
Userlevel 2
is there a manual as how to implement it on a mac on OsX 10.7
I am not so good at programming etc. but still would love to try to use it with my sonos system around +65 K
4 x s5, 1 x s3, 1 x zp 90, 1 x zp 120 and a bridge
I have a new imac on lion connected with a hard disk on which all my music is collected

i went to the page you named found the files, but still i need more indication of how to go about installing and getting ready.
I think there is a market for your work as i look into the fora about sonos.

kind thanks for your very much appreciated work on the system

Drs. Rob Bijpost, psychotherapist
Driebergen
The Netherlands
[email]info@hotel-bijpost.nl[/email]
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Is there a link where sonospy is downloadable and is there a manual as how to implement it on a mac on OsX 10.7
I am not so good at programming etc. but still would love to try to use it with my sonos system around +65 K
4 x s5, 1 x s3, 1 x zp 90, 1 x zp 120
I have a new imac on lion connected with a hard disk on which all my music is collected


Sonospy is hosted on Github. I've been resisting posting the location, as the documentation is not yet foolproof (and not specific to platform). The latest version is at:

https://github.com/henkelis/sonospy/tree/unstable

Most of the testing is on Linux, but people are running in on Mac and Windows too. There's a readme and the beginnings of a WIKI.

Please email me if you need any help getting it up and running.
Userlevel 2
As a relatively recent Sonos owner this issue is probably my only ongoing frustration with the system. Amazing how often an album I wish to hear turns out to be missing from my Sonos library. The one area of performance that does not match that of my old Squeezebox-based system.
I am simply not tech savvy enough to find a work-around for this but wait for a set of simple instructions that might allow my entire library to be available through Sonos.