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Sonosnet + Ethernet = ???


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Hi all,

 

Long time user, occasional poster. I'm toying with the idea of installing some Sonos speakers in the bar/workshop area at the bottom of my garden (roughly 15m from my house, and it seems heavily resistant to any wireless signals).

I currently have a relatively large Sonos set-up IN the house running on Sonosnet with a boost plugged into my router. I have tried just putting a speaker in the bar and hoping for the best, but alas, it is a no go.

 

My question is....if I were to run an ethernet cable from my router in the house to a network switch in the bar, then subsequently hardwire those speakers, would it work?? I get there's STP implications so the switch would need to support that, but beyond that is what I suggest feasible? I've done some searching on here, but nothing seems to answer my question specifically.

 

Thanks in advance, all!!

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Best answer by bockersjv 21 June 2022, 17:31

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Unless you individually switch a SONOS radio OFF, it will be active with or without an Ethernet connection. If the radios automatically switch OFF when an Ethernet connection is established, there would be no SonosNet wireless mesh and all of the units would need to be wired or you would need to use WiFi. Attempting to have some units use SonosNet and some units use WiFi does not usually work well. (except for ROAM and MOVE that use WiFi exclusively)

Thankyou very much, you have confirmed exactly what I thought I already knew. I think that’s everything that’s rattling round in my head at the minute.

Many thanks, one and all 👍🏻

Unless you individually switch a SONOS radio OFF, it will be active with or without an Ethernet connection. If the radios automatically switch OFF when an Ethernet connection is established, there would be no SonosNet wireless mesh and all of the units would need to be wired or you would need to use WiFi. Attempting to have some units use SonosNet and some units use WiFi does not usually work well. (except for ROAM and MOVE that use WiFi exclusively)

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This has all been very helpful, thankyou. One final question, will hardwired speakers still transmit the Sonosnet mesh (in effect acting as extenders) or does the wireless transmission switch off when connected to ethernet? I feel like I should know the answer to this already, but you know when you second guess yourself? Yeah, that!

 

Cheers in advance (again)

The root bridge is a network entity that’s independent of Ethernet, WiFi, SonosNet, etc. It’s the device with the lowest value of bridge priority; if multiple devices have the same lowest priority it’s the device with the lowest value of MAC address. It’s not unusual for routers or other infrastructure items to have a lower bridge priority value (and hence a better chance of being root) than Sonos’ default configuration. This is generally a Good Thing, as the root should usually reside in the core of the local network.

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The sky article describes issue with 100Mbs connections. I actually came across it when checking network matrix was healthy after adding another wired Sonos device, and noticed the STP root bridge was not as expected turned out from the mac address it was a SkyQ box installed a few months back even though WiFi was disabled on SkyQ.

Re PoE Adapters, STP and Sonos, if you are in UK and add Sky this maybe worth a read:

https://helpforum.sky.com/t5/Sky-Q/SkyQ-and-Sonos-interfering-with-each-other/td-p/3589818

 

Read the Sky Q section of:

 

Userlevel 5
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Re PoE Adapters, STP and Sonos, if you are in UK and add Sky to the mix this maybe worth a read:

https://helpforum.sky.com/t5/Sky-Q/SkyQ-and-Sonos-interfering-with-each-other/td-p/3589818

 

Just to say I found the document on IGMP snooping helpful too - thanks🙏,

I don’t have switches with IGMP Snooping (Netgear GS316 & others), but do much-prefer unmanaged switches. I didn’t realise this was an available feature on some unmanaged switches. If I do ever decide/have to upgrade my switches, I will certainly bear it in mind. 

Touch-wood, I’ve not ever encountered ‘storm’ issues with the switches I have and like @ratty my network does have quite a few Sonos products dotted about.

Anyhow I have learned something new today.

If wiring two Sonos units caused a problem it would have been STP related.

 

Yes. As for the IPTV box, my bet is on multicast flooding.

If wiring two Sonos units caused a problem it would have been STP related.

I then swapped the IPTV box for the Boost, same outcome. Then I tossed the switch into the bin.^^

Fine …. it sounds like it fixes an issue with the IPTV box then. 😏

Plugging the Playbase and a IPTV streaming box into a switch that isn’t IGMP snooping-enabled is sufficient to cripple the network. 😚

IGMP snooping helps prevent unnecessary traffic floods, rather than broadcast storms per se.

I’ve never bothered with it in my small dumb switches, but then my Sonos subnet is largely populated with Sonos kit, not other stuff that’s uninterested in Sonos-originated multicasts.

Me, too. :)

A broadcast storm can occur if an unmanaged switch does not support IGMP snooping.

I also use that very switch.  I have never given a second’s thought to STP and to the best of my knowledge an unmanaged switch is not going to have any impact on STP within my system.

I shall have to defer to @Smilja regarding iGMP snooping, as I didn’t know what it is either, although I had heard of it.  Thanks for the link.

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That it’s the very switch i have. In fact 3 of them. All are connected directly to a port in the main router. In tried to not have a seitch connecting to another switch. That keeps issues away. 
it’s also amazing how quickly you find other things to plug in and soon run out of ports on even the 8 port switch. 

@Vegeta_UK, You’d need a switch like this…

https://www.amazon.com/TP-Link-TL-SG108S-Ethernet-Wall-Mount-Protection/dp/B09PGWRVSL?th=1

 

https://community.fs.com/blog/what-is-igmp-snooping.html

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Thanks to everyone for the responses. I realised within about 5 seconds of asking what EoP was (the fact that they weren’t referred to as powerline adapters threw me). Brainfart moment LOL. Sadly for me, they are not a practical solution as my house has a mix of old and new wiring, so the stability is spotty at best (already tested, I had a couple of redundant netgear ones in the loft gathering dust).

Just a question on the switch though...I thought it needed to support STP to stop loops happening and causing issues?? Have I misunderstood requirements? I thought I’d done decent research but IGMP snooping is not something I have come across…. :-s

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Hi 

One more consideration. If the speakers you are adding are not voice enabled (i.e. Fives, Play 5’s, One SL’s, Play 1’s or Play 3’s) you’ll want to add an Amazon Alexa Echo, Alexa Dot or Google Home device to enable voice control.

Cheers for the responses so far. Stupid question probably, but what’s EoP…? 🤔

As @John B has responded, Ethernet over Power. You simply plug an adapter in near the source and connect it to your network with an ethernet cable and do the same at the target end. The benefit is that you don’t need to run long ethernet cable around the house or to outbuildings.

Personally, I find it very reliable - but apparently not everyone does. In our old place I had to drill through walls and ceilings to get a cable downstairs, so the EoP adapters took out all the hassle. It workd best in houses with modern electrics.

Generally, though, a cable is the best connection - but they can be quite fragile, and may need protection when using outdoors. 

You would only need a simple unmanaged switch if you cabled, so no reason for STP to be an issue.

 

A simple unmanaged switch that is IGMP snooping-enabled.

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I too have used EoP or Powerplug but whilst it worked Is was unreliable. Moving to a direct Ethernet cable was a lot better. 

EoP is EtherNet over Powerline.  The data is carried along your electrical wiring.  It isn’t supported by Sonos, and can be problematic.  But for some people it seems to work well.

You would only need a simple unmanaged switch if you cabled, so no reason for STP to be an issue.

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My question is....if I were to run an ethernet cable from my router in the house to a network switch in the bar, then subsequently hardwire those speakers, would it work??

Yes 

I get there's STP implications so the switch would need to support that…

Or just use a dumb switch

Another method (that Sonos don’t recommend) is to use EoP devices. I run the downstairs Sonos devices using these and find them much more reliable than any of the Sonos network facilities - others may differ. I use upstairs switch > upstairs EoP > downstairs EoP > downstairs switch > Sonos kit

 If the outside building is powered from your main consumer unit, then it should work. 

Cheers for the responses so far. Stupid question probably, but what’s EoP…? 🤔

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