Increase Sonos Favorites limit

  • 14 February 2013
  • 72 replies
  • 4720 views


Show first post
This topic has been closed for further comments. You can use the search bar to find a similar topic, or create a new one by clicking Create Topic at the top of the page.

72 replies

There is absolutely no reason why there should be a limit of just 32 "favorites". Anyone trying to claim that anything above that number just doesn't qualify as a "favorite" and supposedly defeats the very notion is seriously mistaken: there are several people in most households, and they can have different tastes and preferences for not just music, but news. Trust me, with just 2 people in a household, me and my wife quickly found to have reached the limit of "favorites", as we like to have quick (instant) access to different news in different languages (there is Monocle for quick roundup of news, there is Bloomberg, CBS, PBS, BBC, EuroNews, etc) and don't want to type their names each time. Likewise, we have several techno, pop, jazz, salsa, and international music stations (Turkish, Azerbaijani, etc) that we like to listen to periodically throughout the day/week. 

Thus, expanding the Favorites is a necessity, and I propose that it be increased to at 100-150. I think each Sonos owner is very different from typical listener - we bought the very expensive SONOS systems because we wanted to depend less on the mainstream FM choices out there, and have a greater global variety that was possible thanks to the Internet. It means any given SONOS listener has a wider number of favorites than a typical person. It is not an exaggeration to say that SONOS users might like up to 50 "favorites" on average. Considering that a typical household is 3 people, that's about 150 "favorites".

Furthermore, it would be great if we could have some general categories, such as "News Radio", "Music Radio", "My Music Collection/Track List", etc.

Alan, adding user profiles would be a great thing - but it is harder to implement than just increasing the limit on Favorites.

I don't understand anyone's logic who wants to have a low limit on the number of Favorites. SONOS chose 32 - a binary multiple of 8 - in its initial version, 1.0, and it proved to be a useful feature but with a very low limit. Doubling it to 64 per profile (because that's the way programming works) would be a good step forward, although it's not clear why would there be any double or even triple digit limits in the age of gigabytes and terabytes. SONOS systems consume a lot of bandwidth - and no one seems to limit that. Yet when it comes to a simple thing like Favorites, suddenly some ultra-orthodox users come out of the woodshed and start opposing progress. 
It's becoming clear in all the comments up to now, that there are different ways to use SONOS favorites. Some do not need any and want favorites removed completely (.....and thereby punish the majority of SONOS users); others want 150 or more.

The latter actually are the correct reference, because they will finally be able to use SONOS the way they wish. Others thereby would be free to use only 25, 32 or, as a matter of fact none, as they find it best for their own purpose. And they would in this way not interfere with the users who need more!

Exactly right. Increasing the limit is the only right thing to do. Retaining the low limit of 32 or removing the Favorites feature would make SONOS less desirable, less user-friendly, and plain illogical.
It's becoming clear in all the comments up to now, that there are different ways to use SONOS favorites. Some do not need any and want favorites removed completely (.....and thereby punish the majority of SONOS users); others want 150 or more.

The latter actually are the correct reference, because they will finally be able to use SONOS the way they wish. Others thereby would be free to use only 25, 32 or, as a matter of fact none, as they find it best for their own purpose. And they would in this way not interfere with the users who need more!

Nonsense.  This thread has (at this time) *13* 'Likes'.  So the popularity of increasing the limit has almost no support; it is a fringe request at best.  No consumer electronics company designs to the fringe, especially when it requires use of memory that can go towards more popular requests, like a bigger index or better playlist management. 
It's becoming clear in all the comments up to now, that there are different ways to use SONOS favorites. Some do not need any and want favorites removed completely (.....and thereby punish the majority of SONOS users); others want 150 or more.

The latter actually are the correct reference, because they will finally be able to use SONOS the way they wish. Others thereby would be free to use only 25, 32 or, as a matter of fact none, as they find it best for their own purpose. And they would in this way not interfere with the users who need more!

Nonsense. 99% of SONOS users don't even come to this website unless something goes wrong, and from those who do, a minority registers and posts/likes anything. Plus it is not so easy to find something. To expect people to spend time on finding the right threads to "like" is ludicrous. Having 13 likes on this topic is actually more than on most other topics. 
It's becoming clear in all the comments up to now, that there are different ways to use SONOS favorites. Some do not need any and want favorites removed completely (.....and thereby punish the majority of SONOS users); others want 150 or more.

The latter actually are the correct reference, because they will finally be able to use SONOS the way they wish. Others thereby would be free to use only 25, 32 or, as a matter of fact none, as they find it best for their own purpose. And they would in this way not interfere with the users who need more!

Other ideas have up to 900+ likes.  Where are those folks coming from, and how diffcult is it for them to find this site?  If increasing the limit on Favorites was as important to people as Google Play suppport, DTS support for the Playbar, or any other of the more popular threads which accumulated 10, 20, 50 times the amount of support, people would seek out this site and find it.  This thread has an absolutely pathetic *13* likes, less than half that of people who want to use Sonos as a doorbell.  By any measure, that is fringe
It's becoming clear in all the comments up to now, that there are different ways to use SONOS favorites. Some do not need any and want favorites removed completely (.....and thereby punish the majority of SONOS users); others want 150 or more.

The latter actually are the correct reference, because they will finally be able to use SONOS the way they wish. Others thereby would be free to use only 25, 32 or, as a matter of fact none, as they find it best for their own purpose. And they would in this way not interfere with the users who need more!

"other ideas have up to 900+ like"?! Really? If you mean just two (2) ideas - our of 16,471 "conversations" on this Sonos site - then it's not that impressive. It actually only reinforces and proves my words. As it stands, there are only three (3) more popular (?) topics/"conversations" on this site ahead of this one (to increase Sonos Favorites limit). That's not that much. We are perfectly satisfied with being the 4th most requested feature. 

But let me also tell you this: our request is by FAR the EASIEST to implement, whilst adding DTS and Google All Play are harder to do from licensing/permission and technical standpoints, and require more maintenance. With Favorite's limit increase, it's just one line of code that needs modification. 
Userlevel 5
Badge +10
I'm not disagreeing that people want the limit increased so they can creatively use the "favourites" feature in a manner it wasn't originally intended. Certainly, multiple users sharing one favourites list are going to hit problems. None of this changes the fact that, quite apart from any memory or useability limitations of having hundreds or thousands of favourites, the clue's in the title - "favourites", not "hundreds of things I quite like". You still have playlists and library browsing and searching, "favourites" is just a shortcut to things. And it's an incredibly useful, free, feature that probably wasn't there when you bought your Sonos.

There's always more that Sonos could be adding. I suspect that features like user profiles, multiple favourites lists or iTunes-style large-playlists-with-their-own-navigation extensions would cover many of the use cases detailed in this thread, but they're not trivial changes. I stand by my opinion that a low limit on the number of favourite "things" you can have is a good design choice.

Note: I'm not just a Sonos user, I'm a software developer, so I know there's no such thing as "just one line of code that needs modification". I also know that, even though the user is not always right, there's no substitute for getting the product out to users and iterating based on their feedback.
It's becoming clear in all the comments up to now, that there are different ways to use SONOS favorites. Some do not need any and want favorites removed completely (.....and thereby punish the majority of SONOS users); others want 150 or more.

The latter actually are the correct reference, because they will finally be able to use SONOS the way they wish. Others thereby would be free to use only 25, 32 or, as a matter of fact none, as they find it best for their own purpose. And they would in this way not interfere with the users who need more!

4th most requested feature?  Where do you get that from?  By my count, even limiting it to just Under Consideration Ideas, this feature's ranking is somewhere around 120+.  Are you ranking them by Recent Activity?  Because all you need to do to raise that rank is post.  Not a very accurate method of ranking popularity.

And you have no idea how EASY it is to implement within the design specs of the Sonos system.  No offense, but in my experience as a software developer, anybody who claims it will only take "one line of code" has never even seen a line of commercial code, never mind actually written one.

Regardless, can you at least agree that the term "unlimited favorites" is an oxymoron? 
But I don't want the Sonos Favorites limit increased. I want it removed entirely.
Surely Terry means remove the limit altogether, not the feature??
I'm a software developer and frankly, assuming enough memory on the hardware, there shouldn't be any lines of code to change. This should be a config change. Anything else suggests poor software design.

-MAX_FAVOURITES=32
+MAX_FAVOURITES=1024

If there wasn't enough memory on the hardware, this would need to be offloaded to an external device, eg DB file on NAS share, or Web service on sonos.com.

Clearly each person has a different idea of favourites. I personally use it to bookmark songs/albums I discover when browsing that I want to come back to later. I just hit the 32 limit after owning my sonos for only a couple of weeks. Given that our music libraries extend to 10's of millions now that we have access to spotify/rdio/qobuz etc, 32 favourites is a pretty absurd limit, but I do very much welcome the favourites feature and grateful that the feature has been implemented at all.

I would suggest, like qobuz, to make it possible to favourite artists too. That can help to reduce the amount of storage needed since by favouriting an artist I can quickly get to any of their songs or albums. I appreciate that may be harder to implement though.

rgds, Tom
Thanks Tom, you are exactly right. I don't understand some participants here who try to fight this very simple and common-sense feature change - to increase the unnecessarily low favorites limit. 
I'm a software developer and frankly, assuming enough memory on the hardware, there shouldn't be any lines of code to change. This should be a config change. Anything else suggests poor software design.

-MAX_FAVOURITES=32
+MAX_FAVOURITES=1024

If there wasn't enough memory on the hardware, this would need to be offloaded to an external device, eg DB file on NAS share, or Web service on sonos.com.

Clearly each person has a different idea of favourites. I personally use it to bookmark songs/albums I discover when browsing that I want to come back to later. I just hit the 32 limit after owning my sonos for only a couple of weeks. Given that our music libraries extend to 10's of millions now that we have access to spotify/rdio/qobuz etc, 32 favourites is a pretty absurd limit, but I do very much welcome the favourites feature and grateful that the feature has been implemented at all.

I would suggest, like qobuz, to make it possible to favourite artists too. That can help to reduce the amount of storage needed since by favouriting an artist I can quickly get to any of their songs or albums. I appreciate that may be harder to implement though.

rgds, Tom


Tom, you're right, but still unnecessarily lenient towards SONOS, who refuse to implement a technically simple feature of the SONOS controller menu. I am getting tired of this discussion over the limited number of available favorites and wonder if SONOS ever did explain their reason for not implenting a larger (=normal!) favorites' option?

As a consequence I actually start shifting towards using Spotify & Co. from my laptop over my hi-fi, where one does not encounter such annoyances. I thereby increasingly negelect my 2 SONOS. 

Maybe one day SONOS will wake up?!

Good luck in the meantime,

jaipee
Userlevel 2
I'm a software developer and frankly, assuming enough memory on the hardware, there shouldn't be any lines of code to change. This should be a config change. Anything else suggests poor software design.

-MAX_FAVOURITES=32
+MAX_FAVOURITES=1024

If there wasn't enough memory on the hardware, this would need to be offloaded to an external device, eg DB file on NAS share, or Web service on sonos.com.

Clearly each person has a different idea of favourites. I personally use it to bookmark songs/albums I discover when browsing that I want to come back to later. I just hit the 32 limit after owning my sonos for only a couple of weeks. Given that our music libraries extend to 10's of millions now that we have access to spotify/rdio/qobuz etc, 32 favourites is a pretty absurd limit, but I do very much welcome the favourites feature and grateful that the feature has been implemented at all.

I would suggest, like qobuz, to make it possible to favourite artists too. That can help to reduce the amount of storage needed since by favouriting an artist I can quickly get to any of their songs or albums. I appreciate that may be harder to implement though.

rgds, Tom


You are absolutely right. It is not just this item, but there are so many little annoyances which are mentioned for a long time, so often, with no solution. Some examples: Think about the limit of tracks, the issue with volume/mute button, albums with the same title, but different artist, which are merged... etc I have the feeling that or Sonos lost somewhere their sources of the program or the guy who initially developed it has left the company, or they only listen to music but not to the users. If you compare the new features in a new release compared to the list of simple things asked, I just can say it is very poor what progress the controller made in the last years.
Userlevel 5
Badge +10
Thanks Tom, you are exactly right. I don't understand some participants here who try to fight this very simple and common-sense feature change - to increase the unnecessarily low favorites limit. 


Firstly, correct me if I'm wrong, but as my "favorites" list is almost all artists, you can certainly favorite them and get instant access to your favorite bands.

Secondly, please stop assuming that "just changing a number in a config" is all it takes to increase the favourites limit. It probably is. But then there's testing (on multiple clients/devices), managing the small amount of memory on the device, etc. These things have to be prioritised.

But mostly, maybe Sonos could easily and instantly increase the favorites limit but deliberately choose not to, in the interests of good design. Sometimes the best UX comes from limitations and restricted features. A comment from Sonos on this issue would be interesting though.
But I don't want the Sonos Favorites limit increased. I want it removed entirely.
I have more than 1300 albums and of course more than 30 favorites, I want no limts on favorites, why shall I limit myself?
Userlevel 2
Please fix the very low limit on the favourites feature. Thanks! 
Userlevel 7
Badge +26
Thanks for the feedback everyone. At this time we don’t have any plans to increase the maximum number of Favorites which can be stored. We wanted to add an easy way to access some of the top played Stations or Artists on your system, your current Favorites. By design, this is going to be a short list.

There are a lot of ways to get access to the tracks you love. One great way is to make a Sonos Playlist with them all and add that playlist to your Favorites. It’ll add an extra tap, but you’ll save a lot of space on your Sonos Favorites list.
Is it necessary to have a limitation?  Is there a registry value that can be changed to toggle this setting off?
Glad you didn't develop my web browser.  Gotta browse links or input text to get to favorite sites and I can only use a shortcut on 32 items.
Badge
Ryan, I believed Sonos was a better company than this. I am really annoyed, to be honest. Making such a great product and then limit the number of Favorites? Really? Someone in Sonos is not doing their job. 
Isn't unlimited favorites an oxymoron?
Is there any idea behind it, I have more than 1400 albums ...
Userlevel 5
Badge +4
I like to use the Favourites list to save all of my favourite albums so I'd like the limit to be expanded. It just seems more organised than saving an album as a playlist. 
Userlevel 5
Badge +2
Think of the favorites list as the (soft buttons) on your car stereo for radio stations.
They are limited, and so are the Sonos favorites as all Sonos players are essentially embedded Linux PC's that can only work with the storage they have physically available. 
Userlevel 6
Badge +16
Think of the favorites list as the (soft buttons) on your car stereo for radio stations.
They are limited, and so are the Sonos favorites as all Sonos players are essentially embedded Linux PC's that can only work with the storage they have physically available. 

Also, in my eyes, having more than 32 favourites would result in people needing to search in their 'Favourites' list, hence, defeating the purpose of it.