Deezer HiFi and Sonos - constant skips and dropouts


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I’ve had lots of problems listening to Deezer Premium on my Sonos system for the last couple of months.  Every track drops in and out (except on my Beam, which is wired to the router) for the first 10-15 seconds of playback.  It even happens when I pause and restart a track halfway through.

I had assumed this was due to wireless interference (I’ve recently added a load of IKEA smart bulbs throughout the house) but today I realised that my issues started when Deezer “upgraded” all their packages - for a price, obviously - to “HiFi audio quality sound” in October.  A bit off-topic, but in my view this was a thinly-disguised and cynical piece of opportunism from a company which put out a press release only six months earlier promising:

“We just wanted to let you know that Deezer isn’t going to raise prices in the middle of the pandemic. Music, podcasts and radio help people cope and we don’t feel this is the time to make things harder for them. If we ever were to increase prices, we would give our users a three month heads up to make sure that it doesn’t come as a surprise.”

Anyway, I’m now wondering if this (compulsory) increase in audio quality is the cause of all my issues.  Is it possible that my WiFi network is unable to cope with the increased amount of data which needs to be transmitted to enable “HiFi audio quality sound”?  Has anybody else had a similar issue?

Today I unplugged all my new IKEA smart bulbs and restarted the router, with no improvement, so that seems to have ruled out interference from them as a cause.

If this is the cause, what can I do about it?  There doesn’t seem to be an option in Deezer to “downgrade” from HiFi music, but is there an audio compression setting anywhere in my Sonos system?  Or do I just have a find a music service which doesn’t insist on charging extra for worse performance?

Setup

Upstairs - Living room, Beam wired to router; Bedroom, Symfonisk lamp

Downstairs - Study, Connect; Kitchen, 2x Play: 1

Currently disconnected - Boost (would it help if I set this up to act as an extender, or would it simply duplicate what the Beam does?)


13 replies

Deezer certainly works hard to fill the buffers at the start of a track, and in a larger group this could be exposing shortcomings with the wireless network. BTW a group should always perform better if a wired device is the first room. 

To start with, check that all the Sonos devices show WM:0 in Settings/System/About. Try different SonosNet channels. Make sure your router is at least 5 channels away from SonosNet, and only uses 20MHz width at 2.4GHz.

If you wished you could post a screenshot of the Network Matrix at http://x.x.x.x:1400/support/review, where x.x.x.x is the IP of a player (not a Boost). Alternatively submit a system diagnostic within 10 mins of a dropout, note the confirmation number, and call Sonos Support.

As you have a device, (Beam, or Boost) wired to your router I would just set that device at least one metre away from the router, if that is not the case already. Also perhaps check you have the following in place:

  1. Ensure both your SonosNet channel and the routers 2.4ghz WiFi Channel are set at least 5 channels apart to prevent signal overlap. So if the routers WiFi is on non-overlapping channel 6 (as an example) then try SonosNet on either channel 1 or 11. Try to use one of the three mentioned channels for your router WiFi.
  2. When running your devices on SonosNet, with one device wired to the main router, ensure you have removed your WiFi credentials in “Settings/System/Network/Manage Networks”  as they are not required and this will prevent Sonos devices hopping back and forth between SonosNet and your Routers WiFi Signal. Only do this step however if you have no portable Sonos products (Move or Roam).
  3. If you have any WiFi Hubs, Access Points, or Repeaters on your network, in addition to the main router, then ensure their broadcasting SSID's and WiFi channels exactly match those of your main router.

You perhaps may also find these two links helpful…

Wireless Interference Document:

WiFi Interference

Wireless Interference Video:

Wireless Interference and Sonos

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BTW a group should always perform better if a wired device is the first room.

Thanks, that’s a good tip which isn’t publicised enough in my view.

To start with, check that all the Sonos devices show WM:0 in Settings/System/About. Try different SonosNet channels. Make sure your router is at least 5 channels away from SonosNet, and only uses 20MHz width at 2.4GHz.

Yes I’ve tried pretty much every different permutation of SonosNet/router channels, with no improvement.

If you wished you could post a screenshot of the Network Matrix at http://x.x.x.x:1400/support/review, where x.x.x.x is the IP of a player (not a Boost). Alternatively submit a system diagnostic within 10 mins of a dropout, note the confirmation number, and call Sonos Support.

I’ve no idea what any of this means?!

 

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As you have a device, (Beam, or Boost) wired to your router I would just set that device at least one metre away from the router, if that is not the case already.

 

Done.

Also perhaps check you have the following in place:

  1. Ensure both your SonosNet channel and the routers 2.4ghz WiFi Channel are set at least 5 channels apart to prevent signal overlap. So if the routers WiFi is on non-overlapping channel 6 (as an example) then try SonosNet on either channel 1 or 11. Try to use one of the three mentioned channels for your router WiFi.

Yes I’ve tried pretty much every different permutation of SonosNet/router channels, with no improvement. 

  1. When running your devices on SonosNet, with one device wired to the main router, ensure you have removed your WiFi credentials in “Settings/System/Network/Manage Networks”  as they are not required and this will prevent Sonos devices hopping back and forth between SonosNet and your Routers WiFi Signal. Only do this step however if you have no portable Sonos products (Move or Roam).

Done.

  1. If you have any WiFi Hubs, Access Points, or Repeaters on your network, in addition to the main router, then ensure their broadcasting SSID's and WiFi channels exactly match those of your main router.

Not applicable.

You perhaps may also find these two links helpful…

Wireless Interference Document:

WiFi Interference

Wireless Interference Video:

Wireless Interference and Sonos

Thanks, yes I’ve been through that list and done as many as possible, but many of them are impractical, e.g. moving components to better locations, wiring them to the network, etc.  Fundamentally the Sonos system needs to be able to adapt to the layout of my house, not the other way around.  The kitchen speakers need to be in the kitchen and I can’t move the kitchen!

Anyway I’m now all but convinced that the new HiFi audio quality is causing my issues, as I don’t get them when using any other music services (Spotify, TuneIn, BBC Sounds, etc.) on my Sonos system.

I’ve asked on the Deezer forum whether there is any way to downgrade/compress the audio quality within my Deezer account, but it doesn’t seem that there is.

Is there any way of doing this within Sonos?  A setting somewhere (similar to the audio compression setting for my line-in Connect)?  If not then I will probably have to find another music service which doesn’t have WiFi audio quality as the only option.  My system clearly cannot cope with it.

The network matrix indicates satisfactory/good signal strengths. There’s no excessive ambient noise showing, though the Living Room device has a later model wireless card which doesn’t report RF conditions in a form compatible with the matrix. 

Basically the local network appears sound, though this is just a snapshot. The full diagnostic -- visible only to Sonos when you submit one -- would reveal where packets are being dropped. I’d suggest you do this, note the confirmation number, and contact Sonos Support.

Oh, and ignore the Boost. It wouldn’t add anything.

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Thanks Ratty.  I just redid the test and got red OFDM ANI level 9 in the study, which doesn’t really surprise me as I have my laptop, hi-fi separates and IKEA wifi lamps in there.

Anyway I’ve submitted some diagnostics and I’ll give Sonos a call tomorrow.  Done enough of this for one day!!

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I spoke with Sonos this morning and they agreed with my diagnosis that this issue is caused by the network being unable to cope with streaming lossless audio throughout the house.  There is no option within the Sonos system to compress the audio quality for more reliable performance.

The suggested solutions were:

  1. Ungroup speakers to create smaller groups when listening
  2. Connect more speakers to the router with ethernet cables
  3. Upgrade to a “mesh” wifi network
  4. Buy some powerline adapters and connect the speakers to them
  5. Change to a music service which offers compressed audio streaming as an option

(1) really doesn’t suit the way I want to use my Sonos system, (2) is impractical, (3) involves considerable extra expense and hassle, as does (4), which might not work anyway.  I will be going with option (5).

The suggested solutions were:

  1. Ungroup speakers to create smaller groups when listening
  2. Connect more speakers to the router with ethernet cables
  3. Upgrade to a “mesh” wifi network
  4. Buy some powerline adapters and connect the speakers to them
  5. Change to a music service which offers compressed audio streaming as an option

It’s extraordinary that ‘Support’ would recommend the highlighted since...

 

Sonos system requirements

Unsupported network setups and devices

  • Wireless internet connections such as satellite, mobile hotspots, or LTE routers
  • Guest networks or networks that use a portal login page
  • Networks using wireless range extenders 
  • Ethernet over Power (EOP) devices
  • WPA/WPA2 Enterprise
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Actually they didn’t suggest that, I suggested it, and the operator said that there are some powerline adapters which might work, but sent me a list of the ones which definitely wouldn’t.

Ah, yes, there are some EoP adapters which block certain types of traffic that SonosNet needs, to keep its topology free of loops.

Devolo appears to work well. If you want to experiment you could get a pair of Magic 1 LAN adapters. (Magic 2 devices evidently run a bit hot.) I’d probably start by ‘wiring’ the left Kitchen unit. 

To be honest I’m surprised you’ve had problems with those signal strengths and a relatively modest number of speakers. Maybe interference is intermittent.

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Oh, and ignore the Boost. It wouldn’t add anything.

Just out of interest, why is this?  Wouldn’t plugging the Boost into the router, instead of my Beam, increase performance?  And why wouldn’t having it in an otherwise empty room act as a “booster”?

I read here (https://freetime.mikeconnelly.com/archives/6050) that:

Contrasting the BOOST device with a Sonos speaker running in BOOST mode, the BOOST device:

  • contains 3 wireless antennae for 360 degrees of coverage and significantly more range
  • has “enterprise grade wireless performance”, and
  • has “advanced wireless interference rejection”

Is this not true?  Or is it just out of date?

I personally thought the Sonos matrix, posted earlier, seemed pretty good. I would have maybe concentrated on finding the source of the ‘likely’ intermittent interference and seen if anything could be done instead to prevent/reduce that happening. I would have thought that would have been a better approach, than a wired setup using power-line adapters.

Oh, and ignore the Boost. It wouldn’t add anything.

Just out of interest, why is this?  Wouldn’t plugging the Boost into the router, instead of my Beam, increase performance? 

Unlikely. The Beam contains a later, even better wireless module than the Boost (which is why it doesn’t report ambient noise levels in the Network Matrix).

 

And why wouldn’t having it in an otherwise empty room act as a “booster”?

In your case a wireless Boost wouldn’t do anything useful. It would sit connected wirelessly to the wired Beam, but wouldn’t act as a relay for anything else. The reason is that SonosNet chooses the lowest ‘cost’ paths across the mesh, which translates into minimising the number of wireless hops. Since your 1-hop signal strengths are already quite sufficient nothing would opt for a 2-hop connection via the wireless Boost.

 

I read here (https://freetime.mikeconnelly.com/archives/6050) that:

Contrasting the BOOST device with a Sonos speaker running in BOOST mode, the BOOST device:

  • contains 3 wireless antennae for 360 degrees of coverage and significantly more range
  • has “enterprise grade wireless performance”, and
  • has “advanced wireless interference rejection”

Is this not true?  Or is it just out of date?

That article is 4 years old. It precedes the latest wireless tech, which if I recall debuted in the Beam/gen1.

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