can we please get dts hd and dts x it is 2022 afterall



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Quite happy too pay a one off fee for a DTS:X firmware upgrade.

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Thanks for the correction, as I said, it’s been several years, and at the time I was looking at a raft of various licensing agreements, not just sound related. Must have a faulty memory about it. 

 

Either way, the mark up on devices they could easily add it. DTS:X is coming to Disney+ in 2 months anyway so maybe that will give them a kick up the backside. There's also another streaming platform adding it in June. Can't unfortunately say which one, but that will be 2 major platforms that will have it. 

Thanks for the correction, as I said, it’s been several years, and at the time I was looking at a raft of various licensing agreements, not just sound related. Must have a faulty memory about it. 

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Last time I looked, and it’s been a couple of years at least, the licensing fee was a monthly fee, and not a one time cost. That certainly might have changed, but still…

 

It's never been a monthly fee. DTS charge a license per device. It's around $20, so it's just Sonos being cheap / lazy sound engineers not wanting to tune their devices to support the codec. It's the only reason why the basic standard 15 year old codec is available as the license went free. 

Last time I looked, and it’s been a couple of years at least, the licensing fee was a monthly fee, and not a one time cost. That certainly might have changed, but still…

Userlevel 2

DTS HD & DTS X would be amazing. Like 60% of my physical media collections would have new life breathed into it! Imagine if sonos made this happen for Christmas 2022. Wouldn't that be incredible. 

I’m curious. Would you pay for the mentioned codecs and if so, how much? What if it was a monthly subscription?

I’m thinking that if there was a suggestion that people might be happy to pay for these additional codecs, then perhaps Sonos might go onto introduce these things as there is probably a licence fee attached to them for their use.

Please don’t give anyone the idea of a subscription for a basic feature. I paid enough for my Arc and Amps and Play5. I can’t stomach the idea of sending money every month too.

Yeah, the world existed before 2021 and a lot of good BluRays out there have DTS:X. For an $800 soundbar, we should be able to hear more than DD 5.1 on Harry Potter and other things mastered earlier.

I could see a one-time license fee if that would be required, but don’t tell me there’s not enough margin in an Arc to pay for a DTS license.

I’ll also willing to pay for the feature/license. Would love to get DTS:X tracks off of my blu-rays. 

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And I'd like to add: like others, I'm willing to pay for the upgrade. 

I literally only signed up to the forum to say that I would also like this feature to be added. Please Sonos, it is 2023 afterall 😉

Me too ^^ It is time to add dts:x support Sonos!

Userlevel 1

I literally only signed up to the forum to say that I would also like this feature to be added. Please Sonos, it is 2023 afterall 😉

Hope that Sonos add the dts hd and dts x support now. 

Imax and Disney+ are releasing movies from Disney library, in Imax and DTS X audio.

So Sonos, what are your intents? With Lg reintroducing DTS, Sony and HISense already in, for sure others will follow . Sonos you should acknowledge that DTS X is not dead, just the opposite.

I may stand corrected here, but I thought LG were only going to offer it as ‘pass-through’ support on some TV models. Dolby codecs will still be available on all their TV’s - at least I thought that was the agreement/intention between LG and Xperi. That said, the more codecs supported by Sonos, the better.

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Hope that Sonos add the dts hd and dts x support now. 

Imax and Disney+ are releasing movies from Disney library, in Imax and DTS X audio.

So Sonos, what are your intents? With Lg reintroducing DTS, Sony and HISense already in, for sure others will follow . Sonos you should acknowledge that DTS X is not dead, just the opposite.

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DTS:X is coming to new LG OLED and premium LCD TVs

05 Jan 2023 | Rasmus Larsen |  

At CES 2023, Xperi has announced a partnership with LG Electronics to integrate DTS:X immersive audio into LG's latest OLED and premium LCD TV models

It’s all well and good having DTS, but if the only way to get it relies on either 1. your TV downgrading it if you don’t want surround on other inputs, or 2. your Blu Ray player downgrading all DTS and Dolby audio no matter what (making you lose things like Dolby Atmos)……...then what’s the point of having DTS in the first place?

Please, @Sonos , even if you didn’t support DTS-HD/X, at least a feature which knows to downgrade the audio automatically when it’s not supported?

You don’t lose Dolby TrueHD (Atmos), it’s just a case that DTS-HD/X isn’t directly supported on Sonos. So just let your blu-ray player transcode the lossless DTS audio to Mc-LPCM instead and leave eARC enabled for all the playing audio.

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It’s all well and good having DTS, but if the only way to get it relies on either 1. your TV downgrading it if you don’t want surround on other inputs, or 2. your Blu Ray player downgrading all DTS and Dolby audio no matter what (making you lose things like Dolby Atmos)……...then what’s the point of having DTS in the first place?

Please, @Sonos , even if you didn’t support DTS-HD/X, at least a feature which knows to downgrade the audio automatically when it’s not supported?

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+1 from me.

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@LBJ2,

Dolby have produced test/demo discs, for users to check each channel output, I haven’t looked online, but maybe DTS have the same option available, but you may have to purchase a demo-disc however, er.. perhaps🤔? Maybe try Amazon or eBay etc.

I found this:  https://www.find-demo-disc.com/2020-dts-demo-disc-vol24-4k-uhd-p-849.html which includes DTS:X and as you suggest may have to go this route to isolate and hear height speakers effect to be 100% certain

So far I have been testing with the movie “Lone Survivor” 2013. DTS:X via LPCM on the ARC. Plenty of helicopter and gun fight sound passed through as LPCM. I do hear the height effect on the Sonos ARC 5.1.2. I compared this soundtrack side by side between the Sonos ARC 5.1.2 and the Sony HT-A9 + Sub which does support full DTS:X. I couldn't tell a difference in the 3D effect for this movie between either system. Both sounded like 3D action to me. Pretty thrilling to be honest--but due to all the other sounds I haven't been able to isolate a particular height speaker sound on the ARC with my ear right to the height speaker with this movie like I have been able to do with some of my Dolby Atmos test blu-rays on the ARC.

I might just need more time to isolate DTS:X height effect via LPCM on the ARC, but regardless DTS:X via LPCM sounds so very good surround sound wise, I'm not too worried. But my OCD wants to know for certain 😉

@LBJ2,

Dolby have produced test/demo discs, for users to check each channel output, I haven’t looked online, but maybe DTS have the same option available, but you may have to purchase a demo-disc however, er.. perhaps🤔? Maybe try Amazon or eBay etc.

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My current question/investigation is around passing LPCM from DTS:X (spacial/object-based sound like Dolby Atmos) from 4K UHD Discs. Does DTS:X object-based/height speaker data layer pass through LPCM?

Apparently Dolby Atmos height speaker effect/data will not pass through LPCM but not a problem since the Sonos ARC processes Dolby Atmos fully to include the two front ARC height speakers.

However, from what I read, the main difference between Dolby Atmos and DTS:X is that you can experience DTS:X using a conventional 5.1 or 7.1 speaker system. 

When I pass LPCM from DTS:X 4K UHD Blu-ray to the Arc 5.1.2, I think I hear the spacial/object-based effect, but so far haven't been able to isolate specific sounds coming from the height speakers with the DTS:X content I've tried so far passed through as LPCM.

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I’ve criticised Sonos on these forums for not supporting DTS particularly when the Playbar was current and discs were more common . The strength of Sonos is simplicity with only one input which also becomes its weakness if the TV doesn’t pass through all audio formats. With less TVs passing through DTS unless Sonos start offering multiple HDMI ports I don’t think it matters now particularly as multi channel pcm (if that’s the correct term) is now supported. From my perspective I very rarely buy discs any more, Apple TV and other services have rendered everything else obsolete. I think you just need to buy with the knowledge that Sonos has limitations for those seeking the latest and greatest audio formats but can’t be beaten for convenience.

So is multi channel pcm exactly the same & It just doesn't say DTS on the app? Or is it different without the proper DTS codec?

From what I think I understand so far, LPCM or multichannel PCM 5.1 or or 7.1 surround sound playback will sound as good as DTS or DTS:HD. Both process full surround sound up to 8 channels or 7.1.

https://www.the-home-cinema-guide.com/blu-ray-audio-codecs-explained.html

I’ve criticised Sonos on these forums for not supporting DTS particularly when the Playbar was current and discs were more common . The strength of Sonos is simplicity with only one input which also becomes its weakness if the TV doesn’t pass through all audio formats. With less TVs passing through DTS unless Sonos start offering multiple HDMI ports I don’t think it matters now particularly as multi channel pcm (if that’s the correct term) is now supported. From my perspective I very rarely buy discs any more, Apple TV and other services have rendered everything else obsolete. I think you just need to buy with the knowledge that Sonos has limitations for those seeking the latest and greatest audio formats but can’t be beaten for convenience.

So is multi channel pcm exactly the same & It just doesn't say DTS on the app? Or is it different without the proper DTS codec?

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I’ve criticised Sonos on these forums for not supporting DTS particularly when the Playbar was current and discs were more common . The strength of Sonos is simplicity with only one input which also becomes its weakness if the TV doesn’t pass through all audio formats. With less TVs passing through DTS unless Sonos start offering multiple HDMI ports I don’t think it matters now particularly as multi channel pcm (if that’s the correct term) is now supported. From my perspective I very rarely buy discs any more, Apple TV and other services have rendered everything else obsolete. I think you just need to buy with the knowledge that Sonos has limitations for those seeking the latest and greatest audio formats but can’t be beaten for convenience.

It was good that they at least supported basic DTS (only recently) because otherwise you would either get stereo or no sound at all from Blu Rays (not that I am 100% sure as I don’t use Blu Rays).  The fact is, people who buy Blu Rays are now very much a niche market and I assume Sonos has to pay a large nominal licensing fee (I really find the hassle of having blu rays outweigh by the benefits personally).   In situations like these I sometimes wonder whether companies like Sonos or even Samsung (which refuses to pay the licensing for Dolby Vision in its TVs) should just offer a service to platinum customers who are willing to pay a fee for these codecs if they really want them.  

So its not a technical issue - that is simple.  Its all about licensing (they are 1s and 0s at the end of the day).  Yes they are penny pinching because a lot of competitors who sell far less product than them pay it.  

 

 

There is also the dev and maintenance costs associated with supportting another format.  You could argue that that is less of a concern for a product that doesn’t provide firmware updates than one that does.  However, since Sonos did eventually adopt DTS, it does seem that licensing was the bigger hurdle to overcome.

 

I do wonder sometimes if Sonos doesn’t adopt a standard because they don’t think it presents their product in the best light, at least currently.  That was the case with bluetooth audio I think.  You could argue that Apple often takes a similar stance, such as having their own Lightning cable rather than following the standard USB.  Apple tends to be praised more for it, as a lot of people trust them, and the have more control over markets.

 

In theory if your internet is 1 gigabit, there should be no reason why you shouldnt be able to stream a full Blu Ray quality video with uncompressed Atmos (even though 99% of people couldn’t care less).  I smell an opportunity for streaming companies to support that in upper tiers for real video/audiophiles who also want the convenience.  

 

I don’t think we’re there yet.  And I suspect streaming services will start offering 8k video before they start offering uncompressed audio.  Just feels like that would draw in more customers, even if it may not actually be as beneficial to customers.  It’s a ways away though as I don’t think gigabit service to homes has nearly the penetration needed for this to make sense, nor do I think streaming services are looking to compete with this sort of offering.  We are seeing that sort of competition with music streaming services because they essentially have the same content, and  higher quality is the only way they really can compete.

 

I actually wonder what the next step is after streaming. Because the thing is with buying physical media, it can often be more of an experience. & releases are often loaded with extras. And if you have your favourite movies on the shelf anytime you want to reach for them they are there. I totally understand having the space though to store them can be problematic. It's why about a year ago I had a clear out and made decisions to only collect movies I would rewatch. Apologies for getting off subject

 

I don’t think the upcoming generation has any real concept or need to buy physical media.  They honestly don’t even really have much of a concept of owning media.  It’s all subscription service to them.  Maybe trends will go back to owning your own digital copy again, if subscription prices get out of control, leading to piracy, leading publishers to look at cheaper a la carte options.  But maybe not.   I do think that eventually, we will move away from the ‘cloud computing’ trend and homes will start having local servers.  I can see a setup where you still have subscription services, but instead of getting the content from a cloud server, you’re getting it from your own home server, that gets updated from the cloud and a much less frequent basis.  Subscription service lowers cost and you get a little more privacy, plus whatever local smart home processing you need.  But that’s a guess.  It does feel like we cycle between local processing and cloud/server processing as time goes by. 

It was good that they at least supported basic DTS (only recently) because otherwise you would either get stereo or no sound at all from Blu Rays (not that I am 100% sure as I don’t use Blu Rays).  The fact is, people who buy Blu Rays are now very much a niche market and I assume Sonos has to pay a large nominal licensing fee (I really find the hassle of having blu rays outweigh by the benefits personally).   In situations like these I sometimes wonder whether companies like Sonos or even Samsung (which refuses to pay the licensing for Dolby Vision in its TVs) should just offer a service to platinum customers who are willing to pay a fee for these codecs if they really want them.  

So its not a technical issue - that is simple.  Its all about licensing (they are 1s and 0s at the end of the day).  Yes they are penny pinching because a lot of competitors who sell far less product than them pay it.  

In theory if your internet is 1 gigabit, there should be no reason why you shouldnt be able to stream a full Blu Ray quality video with uncompressed Atmos (even though 99% of people couldn’t care less).  I smell an opportunity for streaming companies to support that in upper tiers for real video/audiophiles who also want the convenience.  

I actually wonder what the next step is after streaming. Because the thing is with buying physical media, it can often be more of an experience. & releases are often loaded with extras. And if you have your favourite movies on the shelf anytime you want to reach for them they are there. I totally understand having the space though to store them can be problematic. It's why about a year ago I had a clear out and made decisions to only collect movies I would rewatch. Apologies for getting off subject

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It was good that they at least supported basic DTS (only recently) because otherwise you would either get stereo or no sound at all from Blu Rays (not that I am 100% sure as I don’t use Blu Rays).  The fact is, people who buy Blu Rays are now very much a niche market and I assume Sonos has to pay a large nominal licensing fee (I really find the hassle of having blu rays outweigh by the benefits personally).   In situations like these I sometimes wonder whether companies like Sonos or even Samsung (which refuses to pay the licensing for Dolby Vision in its TVs) should just offer a service to platinum customers who are willing to pay a fee for these codecs if they really want them.  

So its not a technical issue - that is simple.  Its all about licensing (they are 1s and 0s at the end of the day).  Yes they are penny pinching because a lot of competitors who sell far less product than them pay it.  

In theory if your internet is 1 gigabit, there should be no reason why you shouldnt be able to stream a full Blu Ray quality video with uncompressed Atmos (even though 99% of people couldn’t care less).  I smell an opportunity for streaming companies to support that in upper tiers for real video/audiophiles who also want the convenience.  

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