SONOS are you reading this? Please put the controller queue function back how it was!

  • 12 September 2016
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353 replies

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Save your queue. Problem solved.
Show your daughter how to play one song. Problem solved. (Just as you showed her before)
Saved queue. Load it again. Problem solved.
Tell/show people how to add a track. Problem solved. (Just as you told them how to before)


That's just the point. Why the extra step of saving a queue? Why the extra step of showing someone how to play a song? Every child who could read could do it with no training before. Why the extra step of re-loading the queue after a child or guest plays a song? Three extra steps for zero reason. And one slip, and the queue could be wiped out. We don't want wiped out queues, and we don't want our guests seeing error messages about deleting the queue. We just want to play music.


There aren't extra steps. There are just different steps.
If the queue is important to you the save it just as you would save any work you create on an electronic device. No extra step.
Selecting a song, no extra step only a different place you select it from.

I agree that tapping a song will wipe your queue out, which can be irritating, until you learn not to.

I agree that tapping a song will wipe your queue out, which can be irritating, until you learn not to.

I know that you are trolling, and that I should know better but ..

What about these points?

1. It is a change which is no assistance whatsoever to me, and many other vocal existing customers here and at other fora
2. The adverse effects of the change would be entirely avoidable if a configuration option was offered
3. It breaks various principals of UI best practice; do not destroy my work ... make every action undo-able
4. Asimov allowed for 3 laws, so lets add another: in the case of a music application, it is *never* permissible to interrupt the currently playing track unless I explicitly request it

There aren't extra steps. There are just different steps.
OK, so what's the "different step" to play something new on a zone with an exhausted queue, where I neither want to destroy the queue, nor want to replay that existing queue at this time?
Userlevel 5
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I agree that tapping a song will wipe your queue out, which can be irritating, until you learn not to.

I know that you are trolling, and that I should know better but ..

What about these points?

1. It is a change which is no assistance whatsoever to me, and many other vocal existing customers here and at other fora
2. The adverse effects of the change would be entirely avoidable if a configuration option was offered
3. It breaks various principals of UI best practice; do not destroy my work ... make every action undo-able
4. Asimov allowed for 3 laws, so lets add another: in the case of a music application, it is *never* permissible to interrupt the currently playing track unless I explicitly request it

There aren't extra steps. There are just different steps.
OK, so what's the "different step" to play something new on a zone with an exhausted queue, where I neither want to destroy the queue, nor want to replay that existing queue at this time?


Having a different opinion is not trolling. It is expressing an opinion. The new way has its faults, just as the old way had.
There are, what, 60 people complaining? Call it 100 or 200. Still a very small sample of overall users. Or is the discontent much wider spread? How do you know?

If you are having trouble knowing how the new works then you need to RTFM and play with it until you've sorted it out. It that trolling, or is it a statement of fact? It's not going to change back anytime soon. So either waste a lot of effort complaining, or use some productive time finding out how to use the new way. It will take you five minutes. And a few more as you will forget until practice has imprinted it.

I am presenting perspective on a "problem". A perspective you don't like but not being able or willing to embrace it will only continue to frustrate and annoy you.

That some people don't like it is a perfectly valid view just as I view the additional functionality outweighs the minus points and overall is not "bad" but has got a bit better. That I now have to select things using a different method is just part of change. Nothing remians the same.
It's not fair to compare 60 users willing to complain here with the total number of overall users. A fairer test is to compare with the total number offering an opinion of any sort. So, how many support the changes, how many are neutral? Fewer than 60 in total I suspect. Even then, it's not quite fair because people are generally more likely to complain. All we can really conclude is that a significant proportion of engaged users (judging by their using the forum) are not pleased with 6.4. I hope that any software developer with this level of discontent would have a bit of a rethink about their design.

Cheers, Peter.
Dear gentlemen from SONOS,
my experience with SONOS during the past two years was awesome. I enjoy the system very much and the only time I had a problem I got great support by phone. I'm really happy with the system! But:
LOSING THE QUEUE IS UNACCEPTABLE FOR ME
So if you take the answers of your valued customers serious - turn this change back!
Thank you!
Userlevel 5
Badge +2
Dear gentlemen from SONOS,
my experience with SONOS during the past two years was awesome. I enjoy the system very much and the only time I had a problem I got great support by phone. I'm really happy with the system! But:
LOSING THE QUEUE IS UNACCEPTABLE FOR ME
So if you take the answers of your valued customers serious - turn this change back!
Thank you!


The queue is still there. That has not changed.
Userlevel 5
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It's not fair to compare 60 users willing to complain here with the total number of overall users. A fairer test is to compare with the total number offering an opinion of any sort. So, how many support the changes, how many are neutral? Fewer than 60 in total I suspect. Even then, it's not quite fair because people are generally more likely to complain. All we can really conclude is that a significant proportion of engaged users (judging by their using the forum) are not pleased with 6.4. I hope that any software developer with this level of discontent would have a bit of a rethink about their design.

Cheers, Peter.


Unfortunately only the people who are disaffected are those who complain. Those who are indifferent or like it, let's call them all indifferent, keep quiet and get on with it. Also consider those who have complained vehemently because they don't like it. Just that. No reason. Is that a valid complaint?

Pining for the past does not progress anything nor will it suddenly make Sonos roll back to a previous version - nobody has even started to imagine the hell that would ensue.

The current iteration is not perfect, nor has any past one been so, but examining this and suggesting how to move this forward/improve it is the way to go (e.g. Someone suggested an undo button), and although there are many who didn't like it in Beta there must have many, many more who, let's be neutral, were indifferent about it (or, dare say it, liked it)

The complaints have shown that everyone uses their system slightly differently (although why people do not save their queues baffles me beyond belief) and that people have developed their own work arounds, an important point, to get the system to do what they want it to. It took me quite a while to get my head around and understand the queue. Now that I do then changes to the way that is accessed and managed are not a problem.

(That changes to underlying systems that mess with work arounds is another conversation entirely)
Those who are indifferent or like it, let's call them all indifferent, keep quiet
I am one of this lot. What is baffling to me though is that I don't recall seeing the sound and fury here on the related public beta thread. Not that it would have made much difference to what was rolled out...but that would be on Sonos, not on beta participants.
Userlevel 6
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Dear gentlemen from SONOS,
my experience with SONOS during the past two years was awesome. I enjoy the system very much and the only time I had a problem I got great support by phone. I'm really happy with the system! But:
LOSING THE QUEUE IS UNACCEPTABLE FOR ME
So if you take the answers of your valued customers serious - turn this change back!
Thank you!


The queue is still there. That has not changed.

Of course it is. But that's not what KM1404 meant. Or what you choose to read into his message.
Userlevel 6
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The queue is still there. That has not changed.Well, it's far easier to lose now. Of course it's changed.

What is baffling to me though is that I don't recall seeing the sound and fury here on the related public beta thread. Not that it would have made much difference to what was rolled out...but that would be on Sonos, not on beta participants.That's the point I guess. For some, you still think that given the reaction, Sonos may change their mind. For those who have been around long enough maybe, they know it's too late for that - but maybe have a glimmer of hope? It's more valid to vent 'fury' (probably too strong a word) in a Production release than a beta..

I am one of this lot. What is baffling to me though is that I don't recall seeing the sound and fury here on the related public beta thread. Not that it would have made much difference to what was rolled out...but that would be on Sonos, not on beta participants.


There were plenty of complaints in the public beta thread. Though remember, people participating in a beta are by the very nature volunteers. In my experience, they tend to be more professional, rather than emotional, in their assessment. Also, beta feedback is more commonly given via a dedicated feedback site, rather than here.
Userlevel 5
Badge +2
Dear gentlemen from SONOS,
my experience with SONOS during the past two years was awesome. I enjoy the system very much and the only time I had a problem I got great support by phone. I'm really happy with the system! But:
LOSING THE QUEUE IS UNACCEPTABLE FOR ME
So if you take the answers of your valued customers serious - turn this change back!
Thank you!


The queue is still there. That has not changed.

Of course it is. But that's not what KM1404 meant. Or what you choose to read into his message.


Then if that is the case then I apologise for misinterpreting it.
Userlevel 5
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The queue is still there. That has not changed.Well, it's far easier to lose now. Of course it's changed.

What is baffling to me though is that I don't recall seeing the sound and fury here on the related public beta thread. Not that it would have made much difference to what was rolled out...but that would be on Sonos, not on beta participants.That's the point I guess. For some, you still think that given the reaction, Sonos may change their mind. For those who have been around long enough maybe, they know it's too late for that - but maybe have a glimmer of hope? It's more valid to vent 'fury' (probably too strong a word) in a Production release than a beta..


The queue has not changed at all. Not one iota. How it is accessed has changed. The queue is exactly the same. Yes, it is easier to lose. We were warned about that so it should NOT be anything of a huge surprise. A few oops! until the chnges are imprinted. Again, it bamboozles me that people do not save their queue, especially when warned it's easy to lose.

But surely the place to vent lots of spleen is the beta as that's the one before release. Complaining that the horse is disappearing into the distance whilst leaning on the open stable door doesn't work.
Userlevel 5
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I am one of this lot. What is baffling to me though is that I don't recall seeing the sound and fury here on the related public beta thread. Not that it would have made much difference to what was rolled out...but that would be on Sonos, not on beta participants.


There were plenty of complaints in the public beta thread. Though remember, people participating in a beta are by the very nature volunteers. In my experience, they tend to be more professional, rather than emotional, in their assessment. Also, beta feedback is more commonly given via a dedicated feedback site, rather than here.


I think that points more towards how Sonos, or any other company, views its beta programme. Is a decision made based upon how many criticisms of certain points versus the number of testers.
I wholeheartedly agree that the beta tetsters would veer towards the professional and that is expressed in the help offered in this forum. But if that is so, then would that not also tend to predicate that that the changes were not as "bad" as subsequently expressed given the testing base. Would a decision be made upon plus points vs negative points?
How changes move forward must be made on balance?.
Userlevel 6
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The queue has not changed at all. Not one iota.When Sonos now adds a track into second place in the queue, would you say that is a change?

But surely the place to vent lots of spleen is the beta as that's the one before release.It happened.

Complaining that the horse is disappearing into the distance whilst leaning on the open stable door doesn't work.Only time will tell there?
BoredofBalham could argue with himself in an empty room! Don't listen to him. I find it odd that he accepts the issue that it is easier to lose the queue and is getting argumentative with people who express a view to get Sonos to improve their software for the better of all. Sonos have listened to their customers in the past and changed their software based on customer feedback. Not everyone was on the beta so this is their time to be vocal.
... and let's not forget that the beta was not available for iOS so many people would have been unable to comment on the changes.
Userlevel 2
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Dear gentlemen from SONOS,
my experience with SONOS during the past two years was awesome. I enjoy the system very much and the only time I had a problem I got great support by phone. I'm really happy with the system! But:
LOSING THE QUEUE IS UNACCEPTABLE FOR ME
So if you take the answers of your valued customers serious - turn this change back!
Thank you!


The queue is still there. That has not changed.


You're just being intentionally obtuse.
This new command is just ridiculous, I use Sonos at work with my team and at home and managed to loose both queues!
Whoever had the bright idea of changing the setup needs to take a long hard look at themselves and the life choices they've made.
Come on Sonos sort it out.
In the new Sonos world order we now need to save our queues as playlists. Good luck with that in a work or multi user environment.
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Looks like they have made some changes with 6.4.8? Nevermind, I was seeing things
Userlevel 5
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BoredofBalham could argue with himself in an empty room! Don't listen to him. I find it odd that he accepts the issue that it is easier to lose the queue and is getting argumentative with people who express a view to get Sonos to improve their software for the better of all. Sonos have listened to their customers in the past and changed their software based on customer feedback. Not everyone was on the beta so this is their time to be vocal.

Only if people were doing what you state. Rolling back is not improving the software.
I assume from your stance that you will now sign up to the Beta programme to provide your input or will you maintain your dustance and denigrate the work the Beta testers have done.
Userlevel 5
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Dear gentlemen from SONOS,
my experience with SONOS during the past two years was awesome. I enjoy the system very much and the only time I had a problem I got great support by phone. I'm really happy with the system! But:
LOSING THE QUEUE IS UNACCEPTABLE FOR ME
So if you take the answers of your valued customers serious - turn this change back!
Thank you!


The queue is still there. That has not changed.


You're just being intentionally obtuse.


Only if you don't read other posts
Userlevel 5
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... and let's not forget that the beta was not available for iOS so many people would have been unable to comment on the changes.

Were there mass complaints on this forum about that?
Userlevel 5
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This new command is just ridiculous, I use Sonos at work with my team and at home and managed to loose both queues!
Whoever had the bright idea of changing the setup needs to take a long hard look at themselves and the life choices they've made.
Come on Sonos sort it out.


Lady Bracknell springs to mind...