SO SO disappointed with SONOS, APPS absolutely useless, which makes the system useless

  • 12 August 2020
  • 33 replies
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Over the years I have bought Sonos Play 5’s x 5 (Gen 1). 1 x Move, 2 x Amps + 2 of the latest Amps, 2 x Play 1’s and 1 x Play 3’s and Playbase. 

In short invested a lot of money and much of it doesn’t seem to work these days. I now have 2 Apps to run the system, is SONOS crazy?

So disappointed on the so called progress, I should have stuck to my British Cyrus system as this is now American junk.

The real question is there anyone out there that will buy it off me and I suspect the answer is NO?

To say I am disappointed with the performance is an understatement. I suggest the App software writers should be sacked and someone who knows what they are doing write an App that all components work satisfactory under.

Did I say I am disappointed, YES I AM?


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SONOS ARE LIKE iPhones.

THEY LIKE TO PLAY WITH THE CONSUMER AND MAKE SPEND HIS MONEY IN NEW TRASH WHEN THE OLD ONE STILL USEFUL BUT NOT LETS GONNA PLAY WITH THEIR BATERY WITH SONOS MORE WITH THE NETWORK OR INTERNET.

 

Show me an iPhone manufactured in 2005 that is still functional today?

SONOS ARE LIKE iPhones.

THEY LIKE TO PLAY WITH THE CONSUMER AND MAKE SPEND HIS MONEY IN NEW TRASH WHEN THE OLD ONE STILL USEFUL BUT NOT LETS GONNA PLAY WITH THEIR BATERY WITH SONOS MORE WITH THE NETWORK OR INTERNET.

Haters will always hate. 

Lots of them are here to whinge in general and can’t even explain what is wrong with their system. How to help when they can’t even articulate the problem other than cry like a self entitled consumers who always claim to spend lots of money on many SONOS products - Why did they buy more than 1 when they have issue?

I think SONOS need to put some buyers restriction on their products. Example:-

*** Warning ***

  1. Products always work in a normal home network environment. 
  2. If you have problem downloading Sonos apps and connecting to new Sonos speakers in the first instance, please immediately return the product as the product is not suitable for you or your home network.
  3. If you choose to keep the Sonos product, please ensure you are able to articulate the issues by writing down the What / Where / When / How observations.
  4. We are here to help, if you want to get help.
  5. There is no age restrictions but if you are not mature in your way of thinking it is not suitable for you, … at all. 
  6.  Sonos occasionally have softwares update and if you have issue, please see point 1. 

  

 

 

 

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Well, a good outcome for me in the end. I won’t go into detail here. I have another thread where I’ve written more. It required a Sonos tech to remote access into my network, but the end result is that my system is now back on S1 & shouldn’t nag about moving to S2 again. All is working as it should. 

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I think there is confusion about the nature of the relationship between Sonos and Creston.  I don’t think it’s really accurate to call it a partnership, as I don’t think Sonos entered in some sort of contract specific with Creston.  Sonos actually has an open API setup so that anyone can develop software to control a Sonos system. They keep the API relatively static, but obviously, it will change from time to time.  It’s up to the other software to adjust their use of the API accordingly.

So in terms of Creston, Creston is responsible for updating their code.  Sonos can provide some assistance with this if Creston wanted help, or involve Creston in testing before S2 was released, but it’s ultimately Creston who is responsible.

As far as Creston’s ability to update their android touchscreen, that likely has nothing to do with Sonos.  Sonos doesn’t have software on those devices (I assume), it’s only Creston’s custom software, using the open APIs.  Sonos dropping support for older OS versions for their controller app should not have an impact on Creston’s software.

 

I don’t think this is right. The press releases stated a partnership, and other web pages from Crestron suggested that their integration with Sonos would be suitable for a commercial environment. And I think that Crestron uses a native Sonos app, not just the APIs from Sonos, at least that’s the way it seems to look on the touch panels, with a brand new app labelled “Sonos” launching to control the Sonos system.

I think there is confusion about the nature of the relationship between Sonos and Creston.  I don’t think it’s really accurate to call it a partnership, as I don’t think Sonos entered in some sort of contract specific with Creston.  Sonos actually has an open API setup so that anyone can develop software to control a Sonos system. They keep the API relatively static, but obviously, it will change from time to time.  It’s up to the other software to adjust their use of the API accordingly.

So in terms of Creston, Creston is responsible for updating their code.  Sonos can provide some assistance with this if Creston wanted help, or involve Creston in testing before S2 was released, but it’s ultimately Creston who is responsible.

As far as Creston’s ability to update their android touchscreen, that likely has nothing to do with Sonos.  Sonos doesn’t have software on those devices (I assume), it’s only Creston’s custom software, using the open APIs.  Sonos dropping support for older OS versions for their controller app should not have an impact on Creston’s software.

Regarding the comment that Sonos should allow a SysAdmin to prevent users from upgrading the system...Sonos is designed for home use primarily, not for use on commercial properties.  You can use it for business, as many do, but that is not what it was designed for.  It’s a bit much to expect Sonos to start catering design features for customers that are not it’s primary market, at least until Sonos has stated they are looking to serve the business market with a business version of the controller.  That said, I do think the notifications pushing people to move from S1 to S2 need to go.  It’s been over 6 months now, and people clearly know it can be done.  The notifications are probably causing more issues, pushing folks to upgrade before they understand the implications, rather than assisting.

 

Sonos should have understood that before they committed to supporting/partnering with a system that integrates into a bulding.

Hindsight is a great thing, but Sonos clearly couldn’t be held back by such legacy issues now otherwise their very business survival could be at risk.

It appears that the only solution would be to back-port S2 onto older Android versions. Doubtless there are technical reasons -- such as the advantages they’ve taken of the evolution of the operating system -- why this is difficult. 

Commercially it might make sense for Crestron to fund some such semi-bespoke development, but I dare say that’s already been considered.

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I haven’t bothered to go digging, but presumably later Creston models do support an Android version recent enough to run Sonos S2?

Yes, but they don’t support the legacy lighting & control systems already installed throughout buildings. For example, our building runs Crestron, (Sonos), Philips Dynalite, SilentGliss, CoolAutomation, Chamberlain MyQ & some alarm system I can’t remember the name of. They all integrate & are controllable through the Crestron touch panels. The new Crestron systems (which run S2) don’t support Dynalite, and that’s fine. Crestron has committed to supporting the older systems for a long time to come, because they understand that buildings aren’t upgraded as often as phones. Sonos should have understood that before they committed to supporting/partnering with a system that integrates into a bulding.

On that basis perhaps it’s a bit surprising that Android was chosen by Crestron for what are such long-lived and firmly integrated bits of kit.

I think it’s set and forget. No need to update. No need to change anything. The short release cycles aren’t a problem.

Well plainly they are, if part of one’s value proposition is to continue to host actively developed third party apps (e.g. Sonos) on the platform. 

I haven’t bothered to go digging, but presumably later Creston models do support an Android version recent enough to run Sonos S2?

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On that basis perhaps it’s a bit surprising that Android was chosen by Crestron for what are such long-lived and firmly integrated bits of kit.

I think it’s set and forget. No need to update. No need to change anything. The short release cycles aren’t a problem.

The Crestron touch panels run Android. The Android OS can’t be updated because of hardware limitations, or because Android is hard to update, I don’t know. In any case, the Android version is fixed. The Sonos Controller app running on the touch panel is written by Sonos & Sonos aren’t writing an S2 app for this version of Android. Upgrade the touch panel perhaps? Whoa there, these aren’t phones or computers. They are fixed panels installed into buildings all over the world, working hand in hand with other components fixed into buildings.

On that basis perhaps it’s a bit surprising that Android was chosen by Crestron for what are such long-lived and firmly integrated bits of kit. Android’s relatively short release cycles and support periods are well known. Sonos, for their part, generally try to support controller apps as long as is feasible, though lack of ongoing maintenance from the OS supplier inevitably brings down the shutters sooner or later.

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As for Crestron’s development decisions I can offer no comment at all. Sonos S2 has been around for quite some time. Operating systems and interfaces change. It’s the relentless way of the tech world. 

Going a little OT here, but my understanding is that it’s actually not Crestron’s decision. The Crestron touch panels run Android. The Android OS can’t be updated because of hardware limitations, or because Android is hard to update, I don’t know. In any case, the Android version is fixed. The Sonos Controller app running on the touch panel is written by Sonos & Sonos aren’t writing an S2 app for this version of Android. Upgrade the touch panel perhaps? Whoa there, these aren’t phones or computers. They are fixed panels installed into buildings all over the world, working hand in hand with other components fixed into buildings. OS’s & interfaces change, but interfaces fixed into buildings shouldn’t change in such a drastic way. If partnering with a company like Crestron, Sonos needs to think like a company that does fixed installations. Otherwise, don’t partner. And I wouldn’t have chosen Sonos.

I can understand the desire to dismiss nags, but in this case the system detects an S2-compatible system and is obviously keen to ‘encourage’ an update from S1. The system itself can see no reason not to upgrade. It’s not being held back by any legacy Sonos hardware.

As for Crestron’s development decisions I can offer no comment at all. Sonos S2 has been around for quite some time. Operating systems and interfaces change. It’s the relentless way of the tech world. 

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So why didn’t Sonos the company make sure that Sonos the system know about this partnership?

Systems are never constrained by controllers. Controllers are entirely optional; they can come and go at any time.

It strikes me that your complaint ought to be levelled at Crestron as you’re their customer.

I don’t quite understand this. I as the customer shouldn’t be thinking Controllers come and go. Before I used Sonos, I didn’t even know what a Sonos Controller was. Sonos advertised themselves as compatible with Crestron. Crestron advertised themselves as compatible with Sonos. Now they don’t work. Crestron didn’t change. Sonos changed. I don’t see how that’s a Crestron problem.

I have another thread where I’ve asked for advice, but one problem I have is that should I actually manage to downgrade my system to S1, what’s going to stop a random “helpful” user in the building from pressing the nagging Update button on the Sonos Controller app on a Crestron screen? Why can’t I (as the system admin) turn that nagging notification off?

 

It doesn’t. You can disable the regular check that the system makes for firmware updates, via Settings/System/System Updates.

Mine doesn’t disable the regular check. I only have an option for automatic update or not. It still checks and it still nags even if you disable the automatic update. 

That was in response to the previous poster’s

None of the IT OS manufacturers force updates on you, so why does sonos?

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It doesn’t. You can disable the regular check that the system makes for firmware updates, via Settings/System/System Updates.

Mine doesn’t disable the regular check. I only have an option for automatic update or not. It still checks and it still nags even if you disable the automatic update. 

So why didn’t Sonos the company make sure that Sonos the system know about this partnership?

Systems are never constrained by controllers. Controllers are entirely optional; they can come and go at any time.

It strikes me that your complaint ought to be levelled at Crestron as you’re their customer.

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So, the system was able to update entirely to S2. And because a third party external controller, about which the system had no knowledge, is unable to stay in step it’s somehow Sonos’ fault?

The system may not have had knowledge of it, but the company certainly did. Crestron & Sonos had a working partnership, which was openly advertised as a selling point for both their systems. And it was on this basis that we invested in Sonos. So why didn’t Sonos the company make sure that Sonos the system know about this partnership?

The problem would not have been a problem if the Sonos system didn’t keep nagging to update. The user should be given the options of Upgrade, Remind Me Later or Don’t Remind Me Again. 

My working system no longer works because it kept nagging to update to S2 and someone in the building presses that button to do so. Now all our Crestron touch panels won’t control Sonos. So much for us choosing the system because of the Crestron/Sonos partnership.

Downgrade to S1? The documented method of factory reset doesn’t downgrade the OS from S2 to S1 on any of my devices. And even if it did, how am I going to stop someone random pressing that nagging update button & having this problem occur again?

Upgrade the Crestron controller to S2? No, Crestron doesn’t support that despite its partnership with Sonos.

So, the system was able to update entirely to S2. And because a third party external controller, about which the system had no knowledge, is unable to stay in step it’s somehow Sonos’ fault?

I’m a happy bunny, but still would like to be able to refuse updates and still have my kit working. None of the IT OS manufacturers force updates on you, so why does sonos?

It doesn’t. You can disable the regular check that the system makes for firmware updates, via Settings/System/System Updates.

However you’d also have to take parallel steps to prevent automatic controller app updates. By default iOS and Android devices autoupdate their installed apps. Since controllers and player firmware have to be matched the update of one may require the update of the other before the system will work.

 

As an aside, most cases of “borking by an update” are typically caused by a duplicated IP after the units reboot post update. 

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However, when the Sonos system demands that you update the software, before it lets you use your speakers and then does not work, because the speakers are Gen 1, does not help the case for Sonos.

Too right. My working system no longer works because it kept nagging to update to S2 and someone in the building presses that button to do so. Now all our Crestron touch panels won’t control Sonos. So much for us choosing the system because of the Crestron/Sonos partnership.

Downgrade to S1? The documented method of factory reset doesn’t downgrade the OS from S2 to S1 on any of my devices. And even if it did, how am I going to stop someone random pressing that nagging update button & having this problem occur again?

Upgrade the Crestron controller to S2? No, Crestron doesn’t support that despite its partnership with Sonos.

Ratty,

I do use reserve addressing, as you are right, it is not possible to assign an address to a sonos device any other way. I have several sonos devices, bridge cr200, zp90, 2 x play 5, and soundbar. The play 5 are switched off, as they don’t work, and the cr200 is sat trying to update itself, as it has been for the last year, but out of sight, out of mind. It’s in a cupboard along with my music server. 

On christmas day wife wanted music whilst having dinner, so I thought, well better try a play 5, and switched it on. when it came up, it appeared in the S1 app on iphone, and wanted to update. Unable to use until it updated, so gave it a try. After this update completed, previous ones had not, then it was available and ready to use. To my surprise it worked. I then switched on other play 5 and after update that also worked. I have not been able to use the play 5 for over a year as they were borked by an update that was unasked for.

I’m a happy bunny, but still would like to be able to refuse updates and still have my kit working. None of the IT OS manufacturers force updates on you, so why does sonos?

However, when the Sonos system demands that you update the software, before it lets you use your speakers and then does not work, because the speakers are Gen 1, does not help the case for Sonos.

I did this, and now I cannot use my Gen 1 Play 5 x2, or my ZP90. The playbar which is Gen2 does work.

You should be using the S1 software. It sounds like the Playbar somehow got updated to S2. I suggest you:

  • factory reset the Playbar
  • remove any S2 controller apps, and reinstall the S1 app
  • when the app starts tell it to connect to an existing system
  • check that the Play:5s and ZP90 are visible
  • add the Playbar to the system and, hopefully, it should downgrade itself to S1

 

The system is connected using a bridge hardwired to my router, and I do not use DHCP on the router, so I dish out addresses manually, (just a paranoid security thing for me).

Unless you sit there as a personal DHCP server waiting to respond to requests I don’t see how. Sonos units cannot be configured with static addresses. Or did you simply mean that you reserve IPs for all your devices?

I understand all of the above points about the network being at fault. I have been working in IT and network support since 1993.

However, when the Sonos system demands that you update the software, before it lets you use your speakers and then does not work, because the speakers are Gen 1, does not help the case for Sonos.

I did this, and now I cannot use my Gen 1 Play 5 x2, or my ZP90. The playbar which is Gen2 does work.

The system is connected using a bridge hardwired to my router, and I do not use DHCP on the router, so I dish out addresses manually, (just a paranoid security thing for me).

I don’t want the new features, I just want to be able to use my sonos, and I don’t quite understand why I am still an advocate for the system, but I am.

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So, you’re not familiar with duplicate IP addresses being handed out by router’s that are in a bad state? Certainly that can happen, even if you haven’t changed your network in any way. And it doesn’t require Wi-Fi, IP addresses are used by both Wi-Fi and wired devices in a network. Sonos, due to the fact that they soft reboot during the software update (just like a computer does when you update its OS) and results in a request for a new IP address from your router. If they receive a duplicate IP address, then there are all sorts of potential issues. Since the fault is in the router, which is responding to a simple IP request from Sonos, the Sonos System has no way of knowing that the router has given them a bad address, and there’s no amount of software changes that Sonos can make to fix potential issues with the router.

iIn fact, it’s not uncommon for router’s to update their OS as well in the background, without notifying you, depending on the settings available in their software. Again, you didn’t change anything in your network, but your network changed, none the less.

And we haven’t even gotten in to wifi interference, and all of the potential external influences that can affect it.

Feel free to blame Sonos if you want, but be aware that in the grand majority of cases, Sonos is not at fault. And I’ve been using S2 since it came out, on 19 devices, with zero issues. 

Cannot agree more!

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