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SAVE THE CR100


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Losing our two CR100s will be the most devastating thing to happen to our household.

My ONE YEAR OLD can play his favourite music by just pushing the button over and over again. My 7 year old will now PESTER ME CONSTANTLY to use my phone whenever he wants to listen to Harry Potter (which is ALL THE TIME)

My parents in law - NEITHER OF WHOM OWN SMARTPHONES will now have to go downstairs and switch on their PC in order to listen to the audiobooks and radio programmes I've given them. They don't use all these 'services', but Sonos is amazing so we built it for them, at great cost for the convenience of having the controller.

My wife won't be able to roll over in bed and hit the volume without blinding us all with your WHITE app in the middle of the night (swipe tap tap tap vs reach and push a button?????)

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE DON'T DO THIS SONOS!!!!!

My Children and in-laws are going to HATE me for this.

DO NOT criticise our choices not to use smartphones, or Alexa, or Spotify. Why should we buy new things to make your system work?

PLEASE don't take away the ability to connect we are happy with basic controls?


What am I going to do now? Tell me WHAT?
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Best answer by Ryan S 2 February 2018, 19:08

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3233 replies

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I'm checking with a contact at Consumers Union (Consumer Reports magazine) on what the US laws are regarding consumer compensation for potentially dangerous electronics (claimed, not proven, and now unclear from multiple sources at Sonos) that are recalled. If any of our friends in the UK and Europe have some context that would be interesting. Is it possible that Sonos will actually do a recall on all CR-100s sometime in the near future? If so are those agreeing to the voucher offer giving up some level of higher compensation in the future if/when the full recall is finally rolled out?

I mentioned that my compensation received did not require me to accept any T&Cs. As far as I am concerned it is compensation for the CR100 being bricked by Sonos against my will. It could still be sitting charging in its cradle after D-day unless they somehow have control over the power circuits in software so any recall should likely apply?


133133

FYI
Could be wrong here, (standard disclaimer) but everything seen points to the fact that Sonos is about to push an update to everything else that will essentially no longer allow the CR100 to communicate with them.
so in effect, they are not bricking the units, they are just not upgrading along with everything else to keep them talking to the players.

how rude.....
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...I think it’s refreshing that obsolesense has been the company’s chosen course of action...

@Ken_Griffiths.
Not sure I can agree with you on this one. This is hardware that was lawfully purchased in good faith outright by the customers (not rented for a number of years), it is either fore-filling its intended purpose (either frequently or infrequently or in some cases collecting dust in a draw) but this remains exclusively the property of the purchaser to do with as they please (including use, sell on or collect dust).

Obsolesense, IMO would imply out of date or not current (I think most would agree the CR100s are not current) but this is not what is being chosen by Sonos in this case what has been choose is an enforced "End of Life". The justification for this course of action is a vague "safety" idea coupled with the inference that product liability magically becomes the consumer responsibility.

IMO. A vague idea of safety does not give Sonos the right destroy peoples property.

In the case of product safety it is a binary choice. (Think of it like being half pregnant:?)
If there exists a product safety issue then Sonos' responsible course of action is to recall the product
If no safety issue exists then there is no action required.

From Sonos' words and actions it must be concluded, this is a corporate decision not a safety consideration. There may well be a case for a companies choice to actively break functional equipment and compensate users accordingly for the inconvenience (the logitech example is a nice one https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2017/11/after-online-outrage-logitech-will-now-replace-harmony-link-devices-for-free/)
Please note in this case Logitech realised that their actions were crossing a line and choose to be generous with their customers and offer upgraded systems to users (where the users could choose to indulge in the upgraded functionality or continue using it as previously used). Whilst I appreciate Sonos have no comparable product to offer consumers, it does not prohibit them from being generous with long term and loyal customers to implement a corporate strategy (Think carrot not Stick).
(I appreciate you considered the voucher to be fair for your number of controllers and their usage but I'm guessing they may well have already been dust collectors for you)

As to this being the future of business:
...It may turn out to be the chosen desired future business model for others too, in order to raise the bar when it comes to public safety in the family home...

I will give the example I used some posts back about a friend whom purchased a nice shinny new Tesla, where part of the appeal being the software "upgrades" coming from the factory.
What happens when a corporate decision comes down to use some vague notions of "safety" to "kill" his pride and joy? (It has batteries after all!:?)

IMO "Squeezing" customers never ends in sustained corporate profitability, its more about short term gains. I thinks Sonos shareholders would be wise to be keeping an close eye on this issue.

It's a very bleak future you paint for humanity! You are clearly an intelligent person, I would encourage to use your abilities for good not evil. This is a strategy and precedent that no one should be supporting

Quote: Edmond Burke - The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Men Do Nothing
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I'm in a complete quandry. I have misplaced a Play 3 so it isn't connected to my system - it is currently in a storage box, I don't know where and hasn't been connected for months! Everything else is currently on 8.4, no idea which version the missing Play 3 is on.

If I connect it in the future, am I right in thinking that it will try to update itself to a newer version and will then kill all my CR100s?

What can I do to stop this from happening?

I can't change the firewall settings on my router to block access the specific ports - I don't appear to have that option, nor to block sonos update pages either :-((

I have a few hours before I go on holiday, and then when I come back my CR100's will be dead, and I can't do anything about it...

It's going to ruin my holiday...


First of all, if you power off your sonos system it can’t update itself.


Yes, I would also suggest simply powering down all of your Sonos equipment until you return. If your router is unable to block ports and access to specific URLs then I would suggest that you consider replacing your router with one that can, then block TCP port 4444 and the two Sonos update URLs BEFORE you power your Sonos system back on. Doing that should be enough to allow you to continue on v8.4 as-is.

If your router is an ISP provided one that cannot be changed out then it should be possible to put that one into bridged mode and use a new router for your LAN, WiFi and DHCP etc.


Try OpenDns and then you can keep your router and still block sonos sites
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I would assume you know that Amazon integration only works on Amazon audio sources not local or Sonos sources. But, yes your right the Alexa integration is no replacement for any controller.

Chris, has that been tested? I was looking at a Fire tablet as possible future replacement when/if my CR100s die a natural electronic death. If the Fire can't access my music library or any other service besides Amazon Music, it's kind of worthless. I looked at the iPort xPress button control Sonos sells, but that looks like it depends on a app you have to have loaded and has many limitations. We use our 3 CR100 daily! It's an absolute keystone to the entire 16 component system and frankly no one in my household likes the iOS APP (although we do use the PC App because we're so used to it.
Voice control is right out! ;-)


The Fire Tablets can access your music library like a normal Sonos app. It just cant access your library via Alexa.
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I only found out about the CR100 being canned last week when I got a message on my controller following an upgrade to the software
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I see there is a message from Sonos dated 23 March added to one of the original postings on this thread. One would have thought that if Sonos were going to create a legacy app in response to these 2000 odd posts, it would have been announced already. I have bought an Amazon Fire tablet which I will begin training my wife to use - she is tech challenged! I don't think the stress of trying to keep 2 CR100's active is worth it, and when they accidentally update, my wife will be without music and I'll probably be on a motorbike ride 100's of kms away!
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Just a thought: If I created a separate account for 1 x ZP120 Connect Amp, and it was connected to the CR100 with no other iPhone app control at all, since the CR100 would not receive updates at all anymore, how could this little mini system ever be accidentally updated? The PC app can also be deleted surely?
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Just a thought: If I created a separate account for 1 x ZP120 Connect Amp, and it was connected to the CR100 with no other iPhone app control at all, since the CR100 would not receive updates at all anymore, how could this little mini system ever be accidentally updated? The PC app can also be deleted surely?

Yep it couldn't. If a system is only controlled by a CR100 then just turning off auto updates would suffice I think (a block at a firewall would be belt & braces). But then you have a single zone player that won't interact with the rest in terms of grouping (may be OK for garage or similar).

I have considered the same for mine and my wife offices as they never get used in party mode, whereas the other main zones for CR100 usage are kitchen & master bedroom. These need to be available for party mode. (note party means house cleaning & tidying - not an actual party - we aren't that cool).

We run a Draytek router and everything has reserved IP addresses so can just restrict these IPs from updates and all can use the same NAS drive for music.

We don't know when in April the update is coming, and Sonos could have a last minute change of heart and create a beta style environment to enable us to be side tracked into safety. I don't see why this couldn't even be done after the fact.

Dave
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I only found out about the CR100 being canned last week when I got a message on my controller following an upgrade to the software

One wonders how many others there are out there with a system not connected to the internet, using just a NAS drive for music. They will never receive the warning about the dangers of using a CR100. These peoples' lives are at stake, one wonders why a formal recall hasn't been issued for these inherently dangerous products.

No CEO would scrimp on a safety recall would they?
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[quote=F00tS0re]
I have considered the same for mine and my wife offices as they never get used in party mode, whereas the other main zones for CR100 usage are kitchen & master bedroom. These need to be available for party mode. (note party means house cleaning & tidying - not an actual party - we aren't that cool).

Dave


Hey Dave, you had me thinking that was supercool. Some slowjams in the master bedroom handled by a splashproof controller. Sounds like a Chris Brown video. 😃 (search up "Freaky Friday" if you want a laugh).
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Just a thought: If I created a separate account for 1 x ZP120 Connect Amp, and it was connected to the CR100 with no other iPhone app control at all, since the CR100 would not receive updates at all anymore, how could this little mini system ever be accidentally updated? The PC app can also be deleted surely?

Yep it couldn't. If a system is only controlled by a CR100 then just turning off auto updates would suffice I think (a block at a firewall would be belt & braces). But then you have a single zone player that won't interact with the rest in terms of grouping (may be OK for garage or similar).
...
Dave

It doesn't need to be completely isolated: you could always connect the isolated part of the system to the rest of it by using some wires and the line-in input of one of the zone players in the non CR100 part. I considered that, but decided it was too much hassle. Also, in my case, the CR100 part of the system would need internet access for the radio so the possibility of accidental update would still be there. If you only wanted to play music from your own collection on the CR100 part of the system you could disconnect it from the internet and be safe. And, if you had wires going both ways, you could also connect the updated part of your system using a line-in to the CR100 part. Clunky, but more or less functional. What I suspect wouldn't work is if the two parts were within hearing distance of each other: I suspect they wouldn't be perfectly in sync because of the line-in delay.

On a different topic: I gave Sonos one of my controller serial numbers in exchange for a £100 voucher (which I parlayed into an iPort XPRESS, so my wife could turn the radio on easily). As far as I'm concerned, I haven't agreed to compensation for any other CR100 controller and, if Sonos change what they're offering to £100 per controller then I'd like to take them up on their revised offer.
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Sign the petition and contact Sonos customer support and let them know what you think.

403 signatures and growing :D

https://www.change.org/p/patrick-spence-ceo-sonos-stop-sonos-from-disabling-the-cr100-controller-from-their-system?recruiter=121008685&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink&utm_campaign=share_petition&utm_term=psf_combo_share_initial.undefined

Also, consider locking down your system to prevent your CR100 controller(s) from being bricked - must be done before the end of March (or the next Sonos update). Checkout my guide here : https://en.community.sonos.com/controllers-software-228995/save-the-cr100-6800510/index86.html#post16220262
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I only found out about the CR100 being canned last week when I got a message on my controller following an upgrade to the software

And here's the problem again. Sharky was lucky he upgraded when he did and he can now take steps to lock down if he so chooses.

Now, if Sharky was a bit more of a casual user he may have chosen to do this in May. Or June. Or November. Or February 2019

Bang, all Sharky's CR100s are "dead" and he puts his call in to Sonos tech support.

He, like me, did not receive "the email". Presumably he, like me, is registered with Sonos and receives sales offers from them, by email, on a regular basis.

I am not naive enough to think that there are millions of CR100 users out there but I bet there's a lot.

I predict Sonos tech will be quite busy over the next few months....
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Ladies & Gents,

Just finalising the letter and have added a paragraph in the conclusion about potential users who know nothing of this forum or the pending firmware release.

It reads:
We know of a number of users on the forum (I myself am one of them) who have not received any email communication from Sonos about this issue. Our concern is that there are other CR100 users totally unaware of this forum and what is about to happen. We suspect these casual users choose - for whatever reason - not to upgrade as and when new firmware is released and our fear is that they will upgrade, "just to get current again", several months from now and lose their CR100s without warning.

Unless there's any last minute contributions, I shall get the letter away 18:00 GMT
Userlevel 2
Ladies & Gents,

Just finalising the letter and have added a paragraph in the conclusion about potential users who know nothing of this forum or the pending firmware release.

It reads:
We know of a number of users on the forum (I myself am one of them) who have not received any email communication from Sonos about this issue. Our concern is that there are other CR100 users totally unaware of this forum and what is about to happen. We suspect these casual users choose - for whatever reason - not to upgrade as and when new firmware is released and our fear is that they will upgrade, "just to get current again", several months from now and lose their CR100s without warning.

Unless there's any last minute contributions, I shall get the letter away 18:00 GMT


You might want to mention that many of the “not informed” users were registered and hence already known to sonos, yet still had no notification. Something has clearly failed in the process to keep people abreast of what is about to happen.
Userlevel 6
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Ladies & Gents,

Just finalising the letter and have added a paragraph in the conclusion about potential users who know nothing of this forum or the pending firmware release.

It reads:
We know of a number of users on the forum (I myself am one of them) who have not received any email communication from Sonos about this issue. Our concern is that there are other CR100 users totally unaware of this forum and what is about to happen. We suspect these casual users choose - for whatever reason - not to upgrade as and when new firmware is released and our fear is that they will upgrade, "just to get current again", several months from now and lose their CR100s without warning.

Unless there's any last minute contributions, I shall get the letter away 18:00 GMT


You might want to mention that many of the “not informed” users were registered and hence already known to sonos, yet still had no notification. Something has clearly failed in the process to keep people abreast of what is about to happen.

Quick tweak:

We know of a number of users on the forum (I myself am one of them) who, despite being registered with Sonos, have not received any email communication about this issue. Our concern is that there are other CR100 users totally unaware of this forum and what is about to happen. We suspect these casual users choose - for whatever reason - not to upgrade as and when new firmware is released and our fear is that they will upgrade, "just to get current again", several months from now and lose their CR100s without warning.
This has definitely been one of the oddest aspects of this whole thing. I just checked the email account I registered my Sonos system under again and I see the response from support from when I asked about the vouchers in early February but I still have never received the original communication announcing the retirement of the CR100.
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This currently is no. 11 in "the list"

11. We accept the "aging battery" issue at our risk although many users have changed their own batteries anyway (a very easy job thanks to internet guides, availability of batteries and the fact that the battery has a plug in connector).

Any thoughts on this? I can easily remove it if anyone feels it creates a legal issue?
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This currently is no. 11 in "the list"

11. We accept the "aging battery" issue at our risk although many users have changed their own batteries anyway (a very easy job thanks to internet guides, availability of batteries and the fact that the battery has a plug in connector).

Any thoughts on this? I can easily remove it if anyone feels it creates a legal issue?


No real issues it is up to Sonos to determine if they can pass the liability onto us. They most likely can't.
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This is idiotic. It just breeds discontent with some of your most loyal users (they'd have to be to have an old controller). Why not simply allow a user to sign-off on the battery (you need this sign-off anyway as not receiving an update is not the same as agreeing to the battery) and freeze functionality on the CR100 to the current set? I have been recommending Sonos to friends for years. I already lost the ability to use an old ipod as a controller and my current android phone doesn't have the level of android to run the latest app. With this change, I can't see myself recommending Sonos any more and can't see myself expanding my system. Others may do the same.
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Sign the petition and contact Sonos customer support and let them know what you think.

400 signatures and growing :D

https://www.change.org/p/patrick-spence-ceo-sonos-stop-sonos-from-disabling-the-cr100-controller-from-their-system?recruiter=121008685&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink&utm_campaign=share_petition&utm_term=psf_combo_share_initial.undefined

Also, consider locking down your system to prevent your CR100 controller(s) from being bricked - must be done before the end of March - LESS THAN A WEEK AWAY. Checkout my guide here : https://en.community.sonos.com/controllers-software-228995/save-the-cr100-6800510/index70.html#post16217266


For the recently registered users: Wot he said
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Well, that's it folks, "the letter" has been sent (full content below)

Thanks to Dash for starting this thread (for the record 8 weeks ago today) and thanks to all who have contributed.

We can now only sit back and await the response.

Thanks again all - absolutely, definitely time for a glass of wine and some tunes I think...


---------------

Dear Patrick,

I write on behalf of the many users expressing their disappointment at your proposed firmware update in April 2018 that will permanently disconnect a CR100 from its associated Sonos system and thus render the controller useless.

You will be aware that there has been a great deal of discussion on your forums over the last 8 weeks, the principal one being the thread entitled "Save the CR100"

This thread has, at the time of writing, 2171 posts over 87 pages.

I agree, some of the content of this thread is heated exchange and unnecessary contribution but it is clear to see that emotions are running high on this subject and the majority of content has been from active supporters expressing their dismay and arguing their points reasonably for Sonos to maintain support for the CR100.

In addition, a petition active on change.org has, at the time of writing, attracted 404 signatures

The petition can be found here:

https://www.change.org/p/patrick-spence-ceo-sonos-stop-sonos-from-disabling-the-cr100-controller-from-their-system?recruiter=121008685&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink&utm_campaign=share_petition&utm_term=psf_combo_share_initial.undefined

Other than the disabling of the CR100, one of the major issues we have is that during this 8 week period, there has been very little input from Sonos other than to confirm to us, again, that we either accept what's happening or "lock down" and accept the "risks"

As a result, and from the contributions on this forum, we have put together the following list which we feel present sound arguments for you to consider as to why support for the CR100 should continue.

1. We don't want our kids using tablets / smartphones to control Sonos in their bedrooms as this gives them unsupervised internet access.

2. It's splashproof and robust - great for kitchen, bathroom, pool, outdoor use & for the kids.

3. We feel we are currently forced (but don't want) to lock down our systems from future upgrades and potentially lose our streaming services in the future as a result. This forced locking down of systems to protect our CR100s is effectively preventing us from ANY future Sonos purchases.

4. Casual users (an example, holiday home users but also anybody who chooses not to upgrade to each and every new release) might innocently perform an upgrade in 6 months and lose their CR100s without any warning.

5. The CR100 is easier for people with certain disabilities to use over a touchscreen / PC based app. In addition, we believe that any person whose hands are too old or too young to have the required level of physical dexterity would struggle to use a touchscreen comfortably.

6. We have invested a lot of money in CR100s (several users citing ownership of 4, 5, 6 or more units) and still see them as an ongoing concern with plenty of life left. We do not want to re-invest in a corresponding number of new tablets (or other equivalent devices) to take over the job.

7. It is easy for guests to use. We are happy to hand over our CR100s for them to use but not our smartphones or tablets.

8. It is our preferred method of controlling our Sonos systems. We do not want to move to solely app or voice controlled methods.

9. Many of us have affixed our CR100 charging cradles to walls and buried the wires. We do not want these to become a useless ornament.

10. We use the alarm clock feature - very easy with the hard buttons.

11. We accept the "aging battery" issue at our risk although many users have changed their own batteries anyway (a very easy job thanks to internet guides, availability of batteries and the fact that the battery has a plug in connector).

12. We are not comfortable about disposing equipment that works perfectly (even through proper recyling channels) - unnecessary e-waste is bad for the environment.

13. It is instantly available to control our systems - we don't want to have to go through the process of unlocking our device and waiting for an app to launch.

14. We like the feel of hard buttons and can use it in the dark with our eyes closed. Other button based options Sonos currently sell fall completely short in terms of full system control.

15. It operates without the need for access to the Internet.

16. It does not depend on a service that has additional privacy implications / concerns.

17. It is dedicated to the whole-home music system so it is intuitive – so much more so than the apps.

18. It has a quick response for essential functions, visual feedback on the screen & great zone control compared to apps.

19. We feel it starts a bad precedence for forced obsolescence which can only be bad for the Sonos brand.

20. The CR100 is a branded Sonos item so anybody using it immediately knows what system they are controlling.

21. We are not seeking to hold back Sonos development at the expense of other non CR100 users. However, the CR100 is a fixed piece of hardware that will never change. We feel that this makes it easy to remain part of the Sonos system for future updates. We accept that new features will not be added to the CR100.

22. As the rightful owners of the CR100 we feel it should be us, not Sonos, that decides at what point to retire our products.

In conclusion
I have owned and used my Sonos equipment daily since 2005 and have never had a need in the past to use these forums.

Judging by many of the users and their relatively low post counts (many of them new sign ups solely to post on this forum), I am not alone.

From reading their posts, these users are genuinely worried, alarmed and confused as to what the future holds for their Sonos systems - systems that they have clearly spent a huge amount of money on.

We know of a number of users on the forum (I myself am one of them) who, despite being registered with Sonos, have not received any email communication about this issue. Our concern is that there are other CR100 users totally unaware of this forum and what is about to happen. We suspect these casual users choose - for whatever reason - not to upgrade as and when new firmware is released and our fear is that they will upgrade, "just to get current again", several months from now and lose their CR100s without warning.

We accept that the CR100 is a relatively old piece of hardware that does not have the capability to handle future system enhancements - we do not expect Sonos to offer continuing future support for the CR100 at the expense of adding new features to the overall system.

Yet, the CR100 is still an extremely reliable piece of hardware and remains for many their first (or only) choice as a means to control their Sonos systems.

For the reasons outlined above, we urge the provision of a legacy software version held at 8.4, available as a choice, when we check for system updates.

This way, we have options. We can choose to remain at 8.4 or, at a time that is right for us, upgrade to the very latest software as and when any new features are sufficiently tempting for us to retire our CR100s.

Another benefit of this arrangement is that we can choose - at any time - to roll back to 8.4 should we decide we want to extend the life of our CR100s for as long as possible.

As and when we install this legacy software, we do not expect any form of technical support from Sonos.

The main benefit to us, of course, is that it will allow us to continue using our CR100s, even in the event of having to perform a full factory reset or reconnecting spare units that have not been used in some time.

The main benefits to Sonos? This would be seen by us as a massive goodwill gesture and we would be happy to continue investing in Sonos components from your entire range as we are aware that all hardware currently available is compatible with 8.4. In addition, we would continue to recommend Sonos as "the manufacturer to go to" for easy to use, well supported multi room audio solutions.

Therefore, we believe the provision of this legacy software is a simple, elegant and hassle free solution for Sonos.

If legacy software is technically not possible, or you simply decide that you are unwilling to provide this option for us, we would be grateful to know the reasons behind this.

Finally, thank you for reading this letter.

Much time and effort has been put in to compiling our arguments and we would respectfully ask that you do the same in offering your response.

Yours sincerely


John Roberts
On behalf of all users wishing to continue using their CR100s
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I guess we don't want Sonos to take too long considering their response as if they do, the deed will already be done...
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I guess we don't want Sonos to take too long considering their response as if they do, the deed will already be done...

Not necessarily. Code is going to be inserted (or removed) such that existing units will ignore the CR100s. Unless they are complete lemmings the code will be retained, as will a complete copy of 8.4 (and every version ever made). Change control software lets the developers insert and remove stuff and track changes. Sonos have intimated they are not sending code to the CR100s so they will carry on calling out.

So even if they issue an update it could be reversed with another update.

That said the longer Sonos stay silent the harder a retraction will become for fear of a backlash from the backlash. I threw my CR100 in the trash and now you reinstate it.

I really don't see the CR100 returning fully and being supported in future versions. But a resilient non-upgrade path via a beta style environment is eminently do-able with tools available now that would allow apps and other things to be reinstated, resets to be done, and an option to upgrade in future.

CEO on leave until next week, lets hope he comes back refreshed and keen to support his customers.

Dave

Edit: Plus we don't know when in April.
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I checked the UK CR100 disposal web page at www.sonos.com/cr100 to see if there was anything new. The page still says one £100 voucher code per household and that it'll take 7-10 business days to be emailed.

The current UK Sonons One deal (a pair for £349) cannot be purchased against the voucher code, but that now expires within 7 days anyway.

The last day for submitting voucher claims is 31/05/18 (UK) and they must then be spent by 30/06/18. The first date is not apparent on the website and I would suggest is the date when we should know absolutely where we stand with our CR100s if they are not working.

I wasn't aware of these restrictions and timescales so thought I'd post it up for anyone else still in the dark.🆒