Constant Updates REALLY ANNOYING


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Who else is getting sick and tired of constant requirement to reconfig and update Sonos Controller SW. Im a LONG TIME Sonos use, love the simplicity, but the bugginess/constant need to upgrade every time I use my Sonos is ruining my experience. Yes I've maybe 10+ devices connected but still. Who's with me?

127 replies

I wonder how many of the continuing 'complainers' here in this thread have still chosen not to...

(a) Add their Sonos IP addresses to their routers DHCP Reservation Table?
...


Sonos Support recommended me NOT to do this when we where troubleshooting my system a while ago.
Do you mean this recommendation has changed?
As my post says T-S, it is one of the first things the 'experienced' community users here suggest to do when the user encounters dropout speaker issues after updating.

Since I personally took that advice onboard, I have never had a single loss/dropout issue with any Sonos update and I can say that is also the case on behalf of family and friends at their homes too... but the other things I mentioned alongside, are also worth considering too, I think, as per my post.

If you have not yet tried these things and are encountering problems with the Sonos updates, then it’s really a matter for you to decide. It’s actually more of a local networking issue, rather than a Sonos related matter, but it appears it has consequential benefits for some routers that may get 'tangled' with (re)issuing IP addresses to multiple devices.

If you are having such similar issues, then the simple answer is to “try it and see” ... there is no problem with doing this in any event, as it simply ensures the network device gets the same IP address and that the address is not issued to any other device. You are giving the speaker a static home with the same network address every time it reboots or your router reboots etc.
Userlevel 6
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Can't see why they would do that.
I had 10.1.1 yesterday...
Userlevel 6
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I wonder how many of the continuing 'complainers' here in this thread have still chosen not to...

(a) Add their Sonos IP addresses to their routers DHCP Reservation Table?
...


Sonos Support recommended me NOT to do this when we where troubleshooting my system a while ago.
Do you mean this recommendation has changed?
I too am getting pissed off with the updates, everytime there’s an update I lose most if not all of my zones for a few hours. So just to clarify, are you still running your devices on SonosNet, with the suggested WiFi/SonosNet separation and have you chosen yet to reserve your devices in the routers DHCP Reservation Table, or not bothered, or unsure of how to do those things and finally have you sought support here before, or with Sonos Support? I’m just curious as to what you may have done over the years about your issues?
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I too am getting pissed off with the updates, everytime there’s an update I lose most if not all of my zones for a few hours. WTF are the Sonos software team playing at? Just update it when absolutely necessary rather than every other week. It’s comical that they announce the updates as “performance and reliability improvements” don’t make me laugh. When I bought into the Sonos system 9 years ago it was super reliable, but now it’s lost its usp and other systems are snapping at its heals. Get your bloody fingers out software monkeys or you’ll be out of a job!
Another, perhaps useful, thing to mention in this thread, is that Sonos also has the “automatic update” feature these days. See attached screenshot, which can be quickly scheduled to suit most users...

When enabling it, within the Sonos App Settings, the feature performs Speaker/Device firmware updates automatically, within a two-hour window and can be scheduled as follows...

Overnight: 2am-4am
Morning: 5am-7am
Afternoon: 12pm-2pm
Evening: 5pm-7pm

If a speaker fails to update, it will retry 5 times. If for some reason the player is still unable to update after 5 attempts, it will hold off until the next day and attempt the update at the chosen scheduled time.

If you were to launch your controller after a failed update, you will not be presented with a message calling out that the update failed, you will simply see that an update is needed.

I’ve never had a failed firmware update so far, since the release of this auto-update feature. It definitely cuts down on the update time immensely and that means the only update required is the Software App on the controller itself, which is often completed in less than a minute, or two, depending on local download speeds.
Userlevel 7
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This is getting offtrack, but whatever.



I understand your point, and respect it just the same. You often underestimate yourself also, but humility is a great quality to have.


I find that kind of humorous because most people IRL tell me I'm too arrogant.


Perhaps it wasn't obvious, but my intentions were never to attack. I, not unlike several others, lose patience with empty complaints. This is multiplied exponentially when the complaint isn't followed by acknowledging (and to some degree) following the professional advice given.


I didn't think that you were attacking in any way.
Applause for that post, Danny. Wish I could "like" it more times than one. We share much of the same motivations.

And I don't have the energy necessary, once I've made a post, to argue my points. Either they can see a different perspective, or they can't, and no amount of "argument" will help. The statements I make I would prefer to stand on their own. Like science, the proof is in the process, not in the arguments about who's right and who isn't.

This is a public forum. I'm happy to have people post opposing views, and if they can support them, it's an interesting read. It's those who can't that boggle my mind. But in the case of feelings, I can't deny someone else what they feel. Just as they can't deny what I feel, and try to support with facts and solutions.

Gah. Rambling. Sorry.
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I'm not always successful at it, but I try and ignore motives in these discussions/debates. That's partially because I don't like it when someone attempts to minimize my own statements/views by claiming I'm just a "Sonos apologist", secretly on staff or something of that nature. A statement is either true or false regardless of why the statement was made. Also, motives are personal, and calling it out can be viewed as a personal attack or lead to personal attacks. I'd rather avoid that.


I understand your point, and respect it just the same. You often underestimate yourself also, but humility is a great quality to have.

Perhaps it wasn't obvious, but my intentions were never to attack. I, not unlike several others, lose patience with empty complaints. This is multiplied exponentially when the complaint isn't followed by acknowledging (and to some degree) following the professional advice given.

Secret Sonos employee claims? Really? Not even going to approach that one. Sorry you have to deal with that.

Cheers!
If I was unable to figure out my voltage supply for my table lamp and can’t be 'arsed' to read how to use a simple volt-meter 'quick start' guide, then YES I would agree to leave it to a friend, relative, or pay someone to sort it for me. However to simply ignore everything, do nothing... and sit there in the dark with a 'broken' or 'unusable' lamp and then start complaining and ranting about it, seems simply ludicrous to me.

I would choose to get the few 'easy' things done, that I mentioned in my earlier post above and then come back and complain when things do not work with the Sonos updates after trying that!!

Read the advice in the community, watch the various YouTube videos on how to reserve IP addresses etc.

I’m certainly no networking expert either, it took me less than 3/4 hour, or so, from start to finish, to figure out how to do such things for myself.

Find a mate, or pay for someone to do it, if you can’t be bothered yourself, but don’t start moaning before doing anything. It WILL undoubtedly be a local networking configuration issue in 99.9% of cases. Of that, I’m entirely confident.
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This surprises me, Danny. Please allow me to be very clear. I agree with your statement -- Sonos is not for everybody. That said, I believe there have been several in this community to offer very clear technical assistance. Those same people would likely contact pacificdiver directly via phone/skype and walk him/her through the process. This issue (at least in part) is a set it and forget it proposition. Reserving IPs does not have to be made more complicated, and at least that element of pacificdiver's issue would be addressed (and potentially resolve the problem altogether).


Yea, I don't think I said that very well, or at least didn't clarify it well enough until later in the post.


What surprises me about your position is that you appear to be giving pacificdiver an easy out here, whereas what I believe they should really (only my opinion) receive is a solution. You can absolutely offer it, as can others.


I can offer some basic advice, but many others offer much better advice. Really, my only advice is repeating what others have stated here already, when it comes to network stuff. My purpose in the last post was to acknowledge that I saw some truth to what was said, even if I didn't fully agree with the entire point.


FWIW, pacificdiver appears to be very passive aggressive and I'm not convinced they want anything else but to keep repeating the same phrase "updates don't have to be so frequent" ad nausea. If that's truly the case, they need different help, and I doubt we can offer it.


I'm not always successful at it, but I try and ignore motives in these discussions/debates. That's partially because I don't like it when someone attempts to minimize my own statements/views by claiming I'm just a "Sonos apologist", secretly on staff or something of that nature. A statement is either true or false regardless of why the statement was made. Also, motives are personal, and calling it out can be viewed as a personal attack or lead to personal attacks. I'd rather avoid that.
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I'm going to agree with @pacificdiver on the argument that reserving IP addresses and other network troubleshooting can be too much for some people. It's not necessarily because they aren't capable of understanding and learning, it's that they are so afraid of tech that they effectively shut down mentally and can't complete the simplist of tasks.



This surprises me, Danny. Please allow me to be very clear. I agree with your statement -- Sonos is not for everybody. That said, I believe there have been several in this community to offer very clear technical assistance. Those same people would likely contact pacificdiver directly via phone/skype and walk him/her through the process. This issue (at least in part) is a set it and forget it proposition. Reserving IPs does not have to be made more complicated, and at least that element of pacificdiver's issue would be addressed (and potentially resolve the problem altogether).

What surprises me about your position is that you appear to be giving pacificdiver an easy out here, whereas what I believe they should really (only my opinion) receive is a solution. You can absolutely offer it, as can others.

FWIW, pacificdiver appears to be very passive aggressive and I'm not convinced they want anything else but to keep repeating the same phrase "updates don't have to be so frequent" ad nausea. If that's truly the case, they need different help, and I doubt we can offer it.
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I'm going to agree with @pacificdiver on the argument that reserving IP addresses and other network troubleshooting can be too much for some people. It's not necessarily because they aren't capable of understanding and learning, it's that they are so afraid of tech that they effectively shut down mentally and can't complete the simplist of tasks.

My mother is a good example of this. She definitely is an intelligent woman, but she was afraid of changing the inputs on the TV for fear she won't be able get cable back on. It took years to get her to be comfortable with the idea. She has a few echos now, and can manage them ok, but I had to setup some Alexa groups for her. There is no way I'd set her up with Sonos as she would not be able to manage it.

(side note: I would get Sonos for mum if she leaved a bit closer to me where providing tech support on a regular basis was a reasonable option)

That's not a knock on Sonos, just that there is a segment of the population that can't handle Sonos, and therefore shouldn't be buying Sonos. But I would say that the frequency of updates really that relevant for the majority of people. If you can't use a screwdriver or change the input on your TV, you're going to struggle with Sonos long before an update happens. And if you can manage to operate Sonos on an every day basis, you should be able to reserve IP addresses and work with Sonos support to troubleshoot networking issues.

As far as the issue of whether the updates need to be happening as frequently as they do, Sonos replied to that and gave reasons why. I'm not sure what the point of further debate on the topic would be.


My father can barely use a screwdriver. Picture a support agent on the phone trying to walk him through the steps given above.

For the record, I have tried many of the fixes listed above. They help, but don't fix the problem completely. What WOULD fix the problem would be to lessen the frequency of the app updates.

And btw, another "An update is available" window literally just popped up on my PC. Oh, the irony.


I've walked hundreds through the procedure. No one yet has had a problem (and there are no screwdrivers involved). On a scale of 1 to Network Engineer, if changing a WiFi password is a 1, reserving IP addresses is a 1.2.

But don't let that reality ruin your ranting.

PS - You do know that update notification is just a notification, right? You can easily choose not to click it, and go about your merry way.
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pacificdiver,

Equating reserving IP addresses with being a "mainframe installer" or "engineer" is hyperbole of the highest order. It's akin to equating making a grilled cheese to making coq au vin. Unless one has some type of handicap, one should not be so harsh on one's ability to perform simple tasks.


My father can barely use a screwdriver. Picture a support agent on the phone trying to walk him through the steps given above.

For the record, I have tried many of the fixes listed above. They help, but don't fix the problem completely. What WOULD fix the problem would be to lessen the frequency of the app updates.

And btw, another "An update is available" window literally just popped up on my PC. Oh, the irony.
pacificdiver,

Equating reserving IP addresses with being a "mainframe installer" or "engineer" is hyperbole of the highest order. It's akin to equating making a grilled cheese to making coq au vin. Unless one has some type of handicap, one should not be so harsh on one's ability to perform simple tasks.
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pacificdiver, with all due respect, you avoided Ken_Griffiths question altogether. In fact, you've managed to avoid several people's questions. Is it possible for you to simply answer the question(s) presented without additional colorful commentary?

Please, answer the questions if you are ACTUALLY wanting assistance. Otherwise, users have no choice but to view the continuation of this thread as the delight you must feel at the sound of your own voice.

One cannot help others who chose not to either accept the help, or refuse to admit they need the help. Which is it going to be?
Userlevel 2
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I wonder how many of the continuing 'complainers' here in this thread have still chosen not to...

(a) Add their Sonos IP addresses to their routers DHCP Reservation Table?
(b) Switched over to SonosNet and set their channel at least 5 channels away from their routers 2.4ghz Channel and removed their WiFi credentials in the Sonos App Advanced Settings?
(c) Accept the case that wifi network hubs, extenders, repeaters and adapters, whilst sometimes problematic, will need to be set to the same Wifi channel as the router controlling their Sonos subnet.

Just these few 'relatively simple' steps solves a good many issues and yet 'the few' continue to complain, without even trying these things for themselves, or otherwise getting a friend, (with some basic network knowledge) to do these (rather easy) steps for them.

It’s almost like saying “My Table Lamp does not worki” without first checking the bulb, the fuse in the plug, or that the plug is connected to an actual suitable power supply.

All I can add, is that I (and a huge majority of other Sonos users), have continually updated our Sonos speakers/devices for a good many years without a problem. I have 15 speakers in my home and never had a 'dropout' or 'loss' issue arising from any Sonos update process... so that to me, shows this is extremely 'highly likely' going to be a local networking-configuration issue, where the user has still not listened to, or chosen to ignore, the much publicised 'community' suggestions and advice.


Networking issues have nothing to do with the concept that the update frequency is far higher than it needs to be. As for the lamp analogy, you seem to be forgetting that the vast majority of Sonos users are not network engineers.

Lamp Owner #1: "My lamp shuts off at random times when it's updated and it's pretty frustrating."

Lamp Owner #2: "That lamp is a complex piece of equipment and most users don't have problems so stop complaining."

Lamp Owner#1: All it's supposed to do is turn on and off. Does it really need to be updated every 3 weeks?

Lamp Owner #2: "I don't know why people whine so much when this happens . All you have to do is open the lamp case, rewire the internal farfegnugen mechanism and then reroute the ASP overrun through the internal (NOT EXTERNAL) routing port that connects to the Allen port and then you'll have no issues whatsoever. You may also need to disconnect and reconnect the lamp's internal LPA regulator so that it can't cause interference with LPB mechanism, or you could potentially cause the formation of a worm hole that might transport you into another dimension. Other than that, it's quite safe."

Sonos is intended for consumers, not engineers. One shouldn't have to be a mainframe installer to be able to get their Sonos to work, no matter how infrequent the problem may be.
I wonder how many of the continuing 'complainers' here in this thread have still chosen not to...

(a) Add their Sonos IP addresses to their routers DHCP Reservation Table?
(b) Switched over to SonosNet and set their channel at least 5 channels away from their routers 2.4ghz Channel and removed their WiFi credentials in the Sonos App Advanced Settings?
(c) Accept the case that wifi network hubs, extenders, repeaters and adapters, whilst sometimes problematic, will need to be set to the same Wifi channel as the router controlling their Sonos subnet.

Just these few 'relatively simple' steps solves a good many issues and yet 'the few' continue to complain, without even trying these things for themselves, or otherwise getting a friend, (with some basic network knowledge) to do these (rather easy) steps for them.

It’s almost like saying “My Table Lamp does not work!” without first checking the bulb, the fuse in the plug, or that the plug is connected to an actual suitable power supply.

All I can add, is that I (and a huge majority of other Sonos users), have continually updated our Sonos speakers/devices for a good many years without a problem. I have 15 speakers in my home and never had a 'dropout' or 'loss' issue arising from any Sonos update process... so that to me, shows this is extremely 'highly likely' going to be a local networking-configuration issue, where the user has still not listened to, or chosen to ignore, the much publicised 'community' suggestions and advice.
rest assured, software is in testing for a good while before it goes out into the wild.
It seems now to be back in the day that I remember that each update spent a significant time in public beta, and prior to that in private beta testing. I am not sure that this release protocol is compatible with the frequency of releases we now see.
Userlevel 7
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I get where you're coming from, @pacificdiver, and rest assured, software is in testing for a good while before it goes out into the wild. I have a lot of faith in our software teams as I've seen some of their world and it's quite impressive.

A fix that might be included in a release doesn't necessarily mean that it was originally broken in the previous release, it could be something unrelated to Sonos software that changed, and we had to adapt to it, or perhaps there is something new that needs to be worked out. Also, the fix could be for an issue that developed years ago, update 10.1 could have had a fix for something from 3.4 that didn't cause an issue until recently. I'm speaking pretty generally here, but the point is that just because an update is coming out, it doesn't mean there was a problem with the previous version. However, with regular releases, we have the opportunity to include fixes if they're needed.
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While we have more regular updates now than before, it gives us more opportunities to release fixes for issues that might have come up.


Not to be stirring up dust here, but shouldn't those fixes be resolved before releasing the software on consumers? I understand that some bugs are unavoidable, but if the reason for more frequent updates is to patch holes in the software that cause major system breaks, I think it calls to mind the question of whether the software should be held on to a little longer so more bugs and corner cases can be worked out.

Code that's worked on by multiple engineers who drive their own ship can get ugly, very fast. I'm not saying that's what's happening here, but it does make me wonder if the software is inherently buggy and that's why there are so many "fixes" being released so frequently.
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@Ryan S - thank you.
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This thread is still going? And now it's somehow about vaccination? Exceptional.

I like to drive off road once in a while. You never know where the path will take you. One thing that's worth mentioning at this point in the thread, is that Sonos updates come out too frequently.

Ok, feel free to talk amongst yourselves.
Userlevel 5
Badge +8
Eh, I'm not really claiming Sonos does have good process discipline as am that there isn't enough information to claim one way or the other really. It's hard to gauge the consequences of waiting to put in a new feature, security patch, bug fix, etc.

And FYI, if I could speculate on another reason why updates are coming more frequently, Sonos used to be a much more closed system. With involved in android and iOS systems, and voice control, they are forced to react to changes made to those systems as well as their own. Again, not necessarily a concern of every customer, but something that factors into to the update decisions.

Completely agree with this. Sure, you could bundle non-essential updates. But if there are security issues - which are becoming an increasing concern as IoT devices become more of a target, or changes on the side of streaming services/voice assistants that potentially break functionality, I would like to see immediate action from Sonos. I think the stream of complaints we would see if Spotify, Apple Music, TuneIn, or Alexa stopped working would dwarf the complaints about updates. What would be the response if Sonos then said: "just wait until the update in Q3"?

If you're not using any of the functions involved in an update, it might not matter to you, but wait until it does. When your Sonos does not even "just play music" anymore, you would rather have that update sooner than later.

Edit: Didn't see Ryan's post until after I posted. Sonos' thoughts on this seem to be similar:

While we have more regular updates now than before, it gives us more opportunities to release fixes for issues that might have come up. If you're familiar with the community, you've probably seen threads where there's a known bug or issue that we're working to resolve and an update would be needed for it. That update couldn't possibly come fast enough for the people affected.

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