Question

Multiple Home WiFi Connections

  • 19 October 2016
  • 22 replies
  • 1477 views

Hi,

At home, I have a few different networks with associated WiFi SSIDs (e.g. trusted, guest, IoT). I would like the Sonos device to be on my 'IoT' network but I want to be able to control it from devices on my 'trusted' and maybe 'guest' network, which, of course, use a different SSIDs ``.

Unfortunately, when I try to control the Sonos from a device connected to a different SSID the Sonos App gives me a message effectively saying 'sorry, different WiFi name, can't do it'.

Now, I don't think there is a technical reason for this block, because if (for testing purposes) I placed the App in one network and the Sonos in another then allow the correct ports between them but make sure their connected to the same SSID - it works (I did this test by connecting to my home VPN, which puts the App device in a different network).

Anyway, short story, can I just tell the App or Sonos to ignore the fact that the SSID doesn't match because I know it will work anyway?

Tried to explain best I can but please ask questions if I haven't made myself clear.

Thank you,

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22 replies

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The "different WiFi name" bit isn't accurate. What's happening is that Sonos relies on broadcast and/or multicast traffic in order for controllers to find the speakers, and normally these kinds of traffic don't easily traverse from one network to another without something to pass the traffic between them. By using different networks to separate your devices, that's why your controllers can't see your Sonos devices.

I know some people with more advanced network setups like yours have been able to use a tool called Avahi to bridge the gap between two (or more?) networks for some of the traffic that Sonos uses (as well as Bonjour/mDNS traffic)... not sure if that will run on your router or not, but if it can, that might be the answer.
Badge +1
MikeV's answer is correct. Passing broadcast and multicast traffic from one network to another is going to cause you association issues. While we don't recommend any specific network settings to accomplish this, you may be able to find third party solutions online.

As a side note, if your guest network is setup using the router’s guest network profile, it will most likely have additional security in place to prevent interaction from one network device to another. It functions like Wireless Isolation, but can’t be configured on guest networks. If that’s the case, no configuration will work other than making your own guest network instead of using the default.

Let us know if you have any other questions.
Hi.
Hi.

I have a similar issue/question perhaps on a larger scale. We have 2 WiFi access points, both with the same SSID so this works fine for mobile devices switching between the two.

The problem is we have a Sonos Connect hooked up to one WiFi point and four Connect Amps on the other. The iPad with the Sonos app can only see the Sonos device(s) connected to one WiFi access point. So we get playback loss if the iPad moves from one WiFi point to the other.

I have read that a solution to this might be to use a Sonos Boost connected to one WiFi router via ethernet and then creating the SonosNet mesh network encapsulating all 5 Sonos devices.

This sounded a perfect solution until I read that the iPad cannot directly connect so SonosNet.

So I'm assuming we will still have an issue when the iPad connects to the WiFi point to which the Sonos Boost is NOT connected ie. the Sonos App now wont see any of the Sonos devices - can anyone confirm if that would be the case?

One solution would be to use an Android device and directly connect to SonosNet.

Is there any other solution for use with the iPad?

How about if the Sonos Boost is connected via ethernet to BOTH WiFi routers - would this bridge the two networks and enable the iPad to see the devices whichever WiFi point it was connected to, or would it cause more problems?

Thanks.
How about if the Sonos Boost is connected via ethernet to BOTH WiFi routers
You'll need to clarify. Are they routers or are they access points? If they're routers -- acting as routers -- they'll break your network into several IP subnets. Sonos devices and controllers must all be on the same subnet.

Let's proceed on the optimistic basis that they are not routers. How is the Sonos connected? Is it using WiFi mode (Standard Setup) or SonosNet mode (BOOST Setup)? Or when you say 'hooked up' do you actually mean the Sonos players are wired? How are the access points connected back to the main router? What would stop you from, say, wiring a BOOST to the main router?
Sorry yes my mistake with terminology, I need to clarify that for myself too.

I fairly sure they are access points. I assume they are connected back to a main router via long ethernet cabling but I'll be able to confirm later today.

Currently the Sonos devices are connected as a standard setup. The Connect is connected to WiFi1 and the four Connect Amps are connected to WiFi2. Both SSIDs are named the same. I think its all on the same subnet, but I'll do some testing today to clarify.

I am making the assumption that wiring the Boost into the main router would mean the mesh coverage not being able to reach all 5 sonos devices. But this depends on the physical location of the main router - something I need to find out. Whats the typical coverage for SonosNet mesh?
SonosNet has similar range to WiFi N, but as it's a mesh it extends itself automatically with each node acting as a relay for the others.

I suggest you find out how it's all connected and configured, and report back. The make/model of the router and the APs would be useful,
If the WiFi AP is connected the the main router via ethernet, can I not use a switch and plug the BOOST and AP into that so both are connected to the main router?
If the WiFi AP is connected the the main router via ethernet, can I not use a switch and plug the BOOST and AP into that so both are connected to the main router?
You wouldn't even need a switch, as a BOOST has two ports. Alternatively you could wire the CONNECT, and one of the CONNECT:AMPs.
You wouldn't even need a switch, as a BOOST has two ports.

Ah yes, because the BOOST has 2 switched ethernet ports.

Alternatively you could wire the CONNECT, and one of the CONNECT:AMPs.

Do you mean connect the CONNECT, and one of the CONNECT:AMPs to the main router?

I'll hopefully have a better idea of the setup after lunch and report back. Thanks for your help so far.
Do you mean connect the CONNECT, and one of the CONNECT:AMPs to the main router?
Yes. Assuming there's an Ethernet feed to the location of each AP you could wire the CONNECT and one of the CONNECT:AMPs directly. No need for a BOOST.

Yes. Assuming there's an Ethernet feed to the location of each AP you could wire the CONNECT and one of the CONNECT:AMPs directly. No need for a BOOST.


Not quite following that sorry.

So you'd have the AP in each location connected into the SONOS via ethernet? and then the other SONOS ethernet port connected to the main router?

What about the other 3 CONNECT:AMPs? Or do they connect using SonosNet?
Yes. You can daisy-chain each AP through the CONNECT/CONNECT:AMP.

The 3 other CONNECT:AMPs will talk to the wired one using SonosNet.

The term 'BOOST Setup' has sowed considerable confusion. You don't need a BOOST for SonosNet operation. Just wire one or more Sonos devices, of any type, and the SonosNet mesh is automatically set up.
OK. Done some more investigating.

The setup looks like 2 APs. One of which is a Dell SonicPoint N2. I assume the other one is the same but can only check later on.

They are connected to a router using Ethernet.

The iPad can see all SONOS devices when connected to AP2, but sees nothing when connected to AP1

Here is the interesting part. The SonicPoint N2 is running 2.4GHZ and 5GHz WIFI.

I can test this using my android tablet by manually telling it to use either 2.4GHZ or 5GHz WIFI.

With AP2, my tablet can connect to 2.4GHz fine, but cannot seem to connect to the 5GHz band - it simply doesn't get an IP address.

What I think is happening is the iPad Sonos app is connecting to AP1 over 5GHz WIFI and not seeing any devices.

When it connects to AP2 its using 2.4GHz and sees all devices.

Does that sound plausible?

If so is the only solution to disable the 5GHZ WIFI throughout?
You're probably getting close. Many APs won't forward multicast traffic between their two wireless segments. This stops a Sonos controller on 5GHz from discovering the players on the 2.4GHz band in 'Standard Setup'.

Wire the CONNECT and CONNECT:AMP, as already discussed, and this problem will go away. Either that or you must prevent your phone/tablet from attaching to 5GHz.
I'm not sure the CONNECT:AMPs are in close proximity to AP2 in order to wire one of them over ethernet. I'll find out later

The CONNECT probably can be wired into AP1 providing I have audio interconnects long enough back to the amp.

Would it be sufficient to have the single CONNECT over ethernet provide SonosNet assuming its range can reach the CONNECT:AMPs ?

And would the iPad connecting over 5GHz still see the devices in this scenario? Presumably it would connect to AP1 over 5GHz and then AP1 being connected to the CONNECT can then see the SONOS devices over SonosNet ?
I'm not sure the CONNECT:AMPs are in close proximity to AP2 in order to wire one of them over ethernet. I'll find out later

The CONNECT probably can be wired into AP1 providing I have audio interconnects long enough back to the amp.

You could always wire a BOOST or BRIDGE instead.

Would it be sufficient to have the single CONNECT over ethernet provide SonosNet assuming its range can reach the CONNECT:AMPs ?

It's a big assumption, considering you felt the need for two APs. Presumably mobiles at the AP2 location have a weak (if any) signal from AP1.

And would the iPad connecting over 5GHz still see the devices in this scenario? Presumably it would connect to AP1 over 5GHz and then AP1 being connected to the CONNECT can then see the SONOS devices over SonosNet ?

Yes. The Sonos devices would be attached via the wired network.
OK thanks very much for your help.

Its looking likely that I'll go with my original idea of wiring in a SONOS:BOOST up to AP2. Assuming its in a central location to the SONOS devices - which I'll find out later.

Because the SONOS devices would be connected over ethernet (via SonosNet mesh) to AP2, I still should be able to see them with my iPad connected to AP1 over 5GHz...have I got that right?
Because the SONOS devices would be connected over ethernet (via SonosNet mesh) to AP2, I still should be able to see them with my iPad connected to AP1 over 5GHz...have I got that right?
Correct.
I now don't think this is related to the 5GHz issue. I did some more testing earlier with my android tablet set to just connect to the 2.4GHz band.

The Sonos app connected on AP2 but when I moved over to AP1 it lost connection to SONOS, just like the iPad does.

So it looks more a case of the connectivity between the two wireless APs is not achievable for SONOS.

Using a netbook connected to AP1 over WIFI, I can ping the SONOS IP addresses (netbook and SONOS all on a 10.0.0.x subnet)

If I connect the netbook to AP1 via ethernet it picks up a 172.16.x.x address and the SONOS 10.0.0.x devices are still pingable. I can also access the internet fine.

I think my next step is to connect a SONOS:BOOST to AP1 via ethernet.
If I connect the netbook to AP1 via ethernet it picks up a 172.16.x.x address and the SONOS 10.0.0.x devices are still pingable. I can also access the internet fine.
Whoa! You have two separate private subnets. Either something somewhere is acting as a second router (complete with DHCP), or there are two DHCP servers on the same segment (a recipe for chaos).
Yes. I've been in touch with the IT company who configured the network to get an idea of whats setup.

It could be that the WAP networks are isolated guests running on a 10.x.x.x subnet.

If a plug a SONOS:BOOST into AP1 then it will likely pickup a 172.16.31.x address. The iPad sitting on the 10.x.x.x network I assume wouldn't see it (back to square one).

So options are either use Android to directly connect to SonosNet, or connect a dedicated laptop with Sonos app via Ethernet to the SONOS:BOOST.

Or even better, could I connect the laptop to the SONOS:CONNECT (physical location is better)?
It could be that the WAP networks are isolated guests running on a 10.x.x.x subnet.
Quite possible, though usually guest SSIDs are identified as such by default.

If a plug a SONOS:BOOST into AP1 then it will likely pickup a 172.16.31.x address. The iPad sitting on the 10.x.x.x network I assume wouldn't see it (back to square one).

It wouldn't see it because it's on a different subnet. If it's on a guest SSID it could be further restricted.

So options are either use Android to directly connect to SonosNet, or connect a dedicated laptop with Sonos app via Ethernet to the SONOS:BOOST.

Or even better, could I connect the laptop to the SONOS:CONNECT (physical location is better)?

You could wire a laptop anywhere into the network. The Ethernet ports on the wireless Sonos units are also available. Note however that (a) the Sonos ports are 10/100 only (not 1Gbps), and (b) the connection speed via a wireless Sonos box will be limited to SonosNet's bandwidth.

Also, to use SonosNet on the Android you first need to connect it via WiFi.