Updates to the Desktop Controller Coming Soon


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Ken_Griffiths wrote:

Sonos say they have chosen to allegedly move in the same direction as the majority of its customers, who apparently perform those admin tasks using a mobile platform.



Which is VERY shortsighted and again, poor business. While stating 'a majority of users' they acknowledge SOME users still do it via the desktop controller. But on the same token, WHY remove it? First rule of thumb in programming ANYTHING is NEVER remove features, only enhance them. Programmer incompetence is no doubt the reason for the removal.

Anyone from Sonos want to chime in as to how many programmers work on these apps? I'm willing to bet just one, and that they have mobile app design experience and no desktop controller programming language experience.
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BCM wrote:

Programmer incompetence is no doubt the reason for the removal.


This is a Sonos investment decision. Blaming the Sonos devs is simply incorrect.
BCM wrote:

Ken_Griffiths wrote:

Sonos say they have chosen to allegedly move in the same direction as the majority of its customers, who apparently perform those admin tasks using a mobile platform.



Which is VERY shortsighted and again, poor business. While stating 'a majority of users' they acknowledge SOME users still do it via the desktop controller. But on the same token, WHY remove it? First rule of thumb in programming ANYTHING is NEVER remove features, only enhance them. Programmer incompetence is no doubt the reason for the removal.

Anyone from Sonos want to chime in as to how many programmers work on these apps? I'm willing to bet just one, and that they have mobile app design experience and no desktop controller programming language experience.


That’s like asking a shop or supermarket to stock every type of product available on the market, in case one or two folk want to buy it... it’s just not practical, nor good business sense.. you have to stock the shelves with what the majority of shoppers want.

It’s the same here, Sonos are directing their resources (however many there are) towards the needs of the majority. All successful businesses operate in this way. It’s a fact of life and undoubtedly those individuals who choose to standstill will get left behind. The Sonos train is not going to wait for you to catch up with the majority of its main customers.
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edmountain wrote:

I honestly think a lot of the invective about this is just people looking for a reason to complain.



And you would be wrong.
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I honestly think a lot of the invective about this is that people have good reason to complain.
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It's not like Sonos has taken away fundamental human rights like freedom of speech or freedom of religion.

If you don't like what Sonos has done then spend your money elsewhere. The market will dictate whether or not a desktop controller survives, not noisy bickering on an internet forum.

For people to threaten class-action lawsuits because they can no longer opt in-and-out of Sonos beta programs while simultaneously managing a twenty-column spreadsheet on their desktop is ridiculous.
T-S wrote:

My personal analysis of those question is that those of us who bought Sonos for playing personal music files (like a ripped CD-library) are on the wrong train with Sonos. It used to be the right choice for us but not anymore.


Yes, I feel the same... It promised a lot of flexibility and a very good UI when I first bought into it, but it's slowly gone downhill. I wouldn't be at all surprised if they start to remove functionality that affects local streaming, so have locked my system down, luckily before the PC controller downgrade.
At the moment, I don't know what the answer is - so I'm looking at different alternatives as they come along to see what would work best for me. Now that I'm protected against future 'upgrades', there's no huge rush - unless some of the hardware fails.
Ken_Griffiths wrote:


That’s like asking a shop or supermarket to stock every type of product available on the market, in case one or two folk want to buy it... it’s just not practical, nor good business sense.. you have to stock the shelves with what the majority of shoppers want.



Responded to this once but the software ate my answer. Probably the same glitch that caused that quote to get put before the response. :D

Anyway, take two: Apples and oranges here. Its not like valuable shelf space is being taken up. It was written in, why take it out? It costs nothing to leave it there for those that choose to use it. Again, it is software. Removing functionality is a poor business decision.
pwt wrote:


This is a Sonos investment decision. Blaming the Sonos devs is simply incorrect.



It's cyclical. If the programmer didn't know what they were doing and the only remedy was for management to order the feature removed, who is more to blame?
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edmountain wrote:

If you don't like what Sonos has done then spend your money elsewhere.



If this issue isn't important to you, then this thread isn't for you. Please take your own advice and go somewhere else.
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I've reached the end of my tether also with these updates - I hate the small screen area on the mobiles. I hate the black screen on the desktop. Ridiculous lack of a linux desktop version (without having to jump through major hoops). I've switched off automatic updates on the mobile controllers - is that sufficient to 'freeze' my system against anymore updates?

You have to put some effort in setting a system up but the only ecostructure which offers maximum flexibility to integrate devices and offer a wide range of controllers (PC, Android, iOS, dedicated handheld controller, alexa & google voice) is Logitech Media Server (free! ).
Annnnd with the always unsolicited, yet seemingly inevitable pimping of the long dead Squeezebox by the one poster still keeping its carcass around, this thread has most certainly run its course.


/thread
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jgatie wrote:

Annnnd with the always unsolicited, yet seemingly inevitable pimping of the long dead Squeezebox by the one poster still keeping its carcass around, this thread has most certainly run its course.


/thread



Rubbish. The LMS system is alive and well - with a very active user community. There are dozens of audio devices (including Sonos) which can work as players/speakers. Lots of streaming services.

I bought a Logitech Controller (brand-new - dated manufacure 2008 !). Worked straight out of the box, connected to wifi, updated to latest firmware, and was controlling my players/speakers in about 5 mins. I used the browser interface to check all was well - as I couldn't be bothered to wait for the mobile to start up and end up squinting at a tiny screen, Compare that with the sorry state Sonos has inflicted on CR100 and CR200 users.
BCM wrote:

Anyway, take two: Apples and oranges here. Its not like valuable shelf space is being taken up. It was written in, why take it out? It costs nothing to leave it there for those that choose to use it. Again, it is software. Removing functionality is a poor business decision.


The features that have been removed from the Desktop Controller (Windows & Mac) require a login to Sonos Account. So yes, it was most certainly an investment decision so they hadn't to deal with rewriting obsolete code.
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BCM wrote:

pwt wrote:


This is a Sonos investment decision. Blaming the Sonos devs is simply incorrect.


It's cyclical. If the programmer didn't know what they were doing and the only remedy was for management to order the feature removed, who is more to blame?


Management, 100%. (And I used to manage hundreds of developers.)
But this is far, far more likely to be a deliberate investment decision.
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BCM wrote:

Ken_Griffiths wrote:


That’s like asking a shop or supermarket to stock every type of product available on the market, in case one or two folk want to buy it... it’s just not practical, nor good business sense.. you have to stock the shelves with what the majority of shoppers want.



Responded to this once but the software ate my answer. Probably the same glitch that caused that quote to get put before the response. :D

Anyway, take two: Apples and oranges here. Its not like valuable shelf space is being taken up. It was written in, why take it out? It costs nothing to leave it there for those that choose to use it. Again, it is software. Removing functionality is a poor business decision.


It's quite possible that the code required to discover and configure new hardware on a network is very vulnerable to local configuration changes and hardware settings. These kind of issues are much less likely to arise on a mobile device and if they do the app can likely prompt the user for permission to change the necessary setting. The end result is that it's easy to imagine the desktop version causing a disproportionate number of support requests (and hence cost) to Sonos versus the mobile version. So it's not true to say that it costs nothing to leave the desktop stuff there.

Every single network toy I've purchased in the last couple of years (Chromecast, Google Wifi, Google home, Hue light bulbs, Nest devices, Netatmo weather station, even my BB-8) is accessible only through a mobile app without even the thought of a desktop interface. Even TVs are slowly moving away from the remote control to a mobile app. It's where the world is going and there's a cost to maintaining the status quo. Small wonder Sonos made this decision.
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edmountain wrote: If you don't like what Sonos has done then spend your money elsewhere.

Too late, we've already spent the money. Criticism is important. Blind adoration and sycophancy gets you nowhere.
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alan8 wrote:

edmountain wrote: If you don't like what Sonos has done then spend your money elsewhere.

Too late, we've already spent the money. Criticism is important. Blind adoration and sycophancy gets you nowhere.


The only criticism a multi-billion dollar corporation like Sonos will listen to is to return your newly-purchased Beam and to get your money back from them. So long as your money is in their bank account they will not listen to anything.
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[quote=edmountain][quote=BCM]
Ken_Griffiths wrote:


It's quite possible that the code required to discover and configure new hardware on a network is very vulnerable to local configuration changes and hardware settings ...



I find that hard to believe. I have a small app for something like 3 dollars on my computer since years back called IP-scanner. It manages to find my Sonos components, all the time.Why should it be more difficult for Sonos own application?

Sonos quite obviously want an absolute minimum of platforms to support. I recently found this little thread. Same issue but with Kindle:
https://en.community.sonos.com/controllers-software-228995/kindle-fire-2nd-generation-no-longer-supported-by-sonos-controller-app-6800320

It keeps happening all the time. Buy a controller (in the early days a remote) and it will slowly degrade, funcions will be reduced and finally it will be dropped.
T-S wrote:

It keeps happening all the time. Buy a controller (in the early days a remote) and it will slowly degrade, funcions will be reduced and finally it will be dropped.


So you've never stumbled upon "Your device isn't compatible with this version" on Google Play Store?

https://bit.ly/2ExtHFm
castalla wrote:

jgatie wrote:

Annnnd with the always unsolicited, yet seemingly inevitable pimping of the long dead Squeezebox by the one poster still keeping its carcass around, this thread has most certainly run its course.


/thread



Rubbish. The LMS system is alive and well - with a very active user community. There are dozens of audio devices (including Sonos) which can work as players/speakers. Lots of streaming services.

I bought a Logitech Controller (brand-new - dated manufacure 2008 !). Worked straight out of the box, connected to wifi, updated to latest firmware, and was controlling my players/speakers in about 5 mins. I used the browser interface to check all was well - as I couldn't be bothered to wait for the mobile to start up and end up squinting at a tiny screen, Compare that with the sorry state Sonos has inflicted on CR100 and CR200 users.



Not rubbish. The fact that you and a couple others have propped up its dessicated corpse, there has been no hardware sold under the name Squeezebox in years. The very fact you had to purchase something manufactured a decade ago just proves my point.
I have a bit of an odd setup, I don't have adsl so my router uses my phone internet to be online and what it also means now that the controller got the setting up option remove is that I can't get my sonos added because my phone can't share it's 4G connection on connect to the wifi at the same time.

It worked great from my computer before the update...
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jgatie wrote:

castalla wrote:

jgatie wrote:

Annnnd with the always unsolicited, yet seemingly inevitable pimping of the long dead Squeezebox by the one poster still keeping its carcass around, this thread has most certainly run its course.


/thread



Rubbish. The LMS system is alive and well - with a very active user community. There are dozens of audio devices (including Sonos) which can work as players/speakers. Lots of streaming services.

I bought a Logitech Controller (brand-new - dated manufacure 2008 !). Worked straight out of the box, connected to wifi, updated to latest firmware, and was controlling my players/speakers in about 5 mins. I used the browser interface to check all was well - as I couldn't be bothered to wait for the mobile to start up and end up squinting at a tiny screen, Compare that with the sorry state Sonos has inflicted on CR100 and CR200 users.



Not rubbish. The fact that you and a couple others have propped up its dessicated corpse, there has been no hardware sold under the name Squeezebox in years. The very fact you had to purchase something manufactured a decade ago just proves my point.



Ridiculous statement - there are probably a couple of thousand active users of original squeezebox devices and the spinoffs. Dessicated corpse?
Another misinformed description - where's BBC iPlayer on Sonos (oh yes there's Tunein mp3 streams, and no catch-up)?

At least the LMS controller worked without issue (and won't tie me up for a day on a support call involving technicians accessing my system, if it goes wrong) - unlike the load of defunct cr100s and faulty cr200s people are trying to flog on ebay, They'll probably kill off the cr200 in short order, so users are dumping them already.
Its like an AMC Gremlin fan posting on a Lexus forum in here sometimes.
castalla wrote:


I bought a Logitech Controller (brand-new - dated manufacure 2008 !). Worked straight out of the box, connected to wifi, updated to latest firmware, and was controlling my players/speakers in about 5 mins.



You just described my first Sonos experience... circa 2008. Ah the good old days.

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