Introducing Trueplay and the New PLAY:5

  • 29 September 2015
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@sbsurfer, I'm not sure what your point is. I should take what I am given and never ask for anything else? I should always assume that the features provided by someone are the best for me, and if I want something else, then I'm whiny and/or wrong?

If that's true then what's the point of these forums? I'm a SONOS customer, obviously, because it represented the best overall value to me in terms of features and cost. That doesn't mean it's perfect. Companies ignore their customers feedback at their own peril.

@chicks - yes, that is exactly what I said. But hey, you could just not buy a SONOS in the first place and do that with a much cheaper competitor if you didn't find any value in the SONOS all-in-one UI. That's the point. SONOS isn't just a speaker. There are lots of wireeless networked speakers, and most cost a lot less than SONOS. If it was no big deal to me to just use whatever client in a non-integrated fashion, I wouldn't own SONOS. What sets SONOS apart from its competitors is exactly this: being able to work from a single front-end against all my music sources.
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or don't lose focus on what a product is supposed to do and why you bought it.

I think there's a space between discussing things that could make a great product even better, and losing focus on why you bought it.

I bought SONOS to create the best overall experience for listening to music. SONOS is a great experience in my house. Once I leave, I no longer have that experience. I work around this as @chicks says, but it's a pain. I run a subsonic server so I can access my home media library remotely. On my phone is google play, subsonic, amazon music, spotify, probably more I'm forgetting. I have no ability to use playlists created with SONOS remotely. I have no ability to search across music sources.

This is 2015, I could do this with Squeezebox ten years ago. Obviously, this is not a technological problem, it's a business decision. That's fine, and I understand that, but it seems odd to me that discussion of a feature with obvious value, and one which I am sure I'm not alone in wanting, would be mocked as complaining about not getting a pickle with a sandwich.
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Hey I didn't post the story....and I don't even like pickles. Tiny flags are cool though!
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Hey I didn't post the story....and I don't even like pickles. Tiny flags are cool though!

No argument there. I do like pickles though. I might even get a little downcast if I got home and found my pickle missing.
Might just be that offering "features" which produce no income, may even cost income by allowing people to forego a hardware purchase, definitely cost support man-hours, and were offered by a product line which is now defunct, is not the stellar business plan Sonos wishes to emulate.
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actually Jamietre I'm with you on the headphone jack is needed side.

personally I don't think Sonos is that short sighted. If they removed the headphone jack .... to me that means #1 it was rather useless before but there way to at least add a headphone support #2 they must have another headphone option on the horizon to replace it.

So it could be good news with something new down the road to replace that functionality. Stand alone headphones? New Connect with headphone output (where it probably originally belonged if not the Play:1)?

** this is absolute speculation I have not a single clue as to upcoming Sonos hardware.
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I mean really people have been begging for actual Sonos Headphones .... not adding more headphone jacks to more speakers.

Sonos introduces the all new Sonos Play:H wireless headphones and this talk of Play:5 not having a headphone jack will be DEAD.
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Softclient = death of Sonos (as happened to Squeezebox)

oh yea - what jgatie said above!
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@jgatie, I understand that, it's a business decision. But that doesn't mean it's a good one in the long run. Tthere's no such thing as an income-producing feature. SONOS makes money when they sell a speaker. People buy a SONOS speaker because it represents a good value to them. The value is the sum of all the features. It is no more an income-producing feature than Spotify support is. I would have bought a SONOS years ago, except for the 65K file limit and this problem. I finally switched when Subsonic started offering SONOS support which kind of kills 2 birds with one stone (the 65k limit and remote streaming) but it's still something else I gotta deal with and integration is less than ideal.

History: Slim Devices got bought out by Logitech for $20 million. They sold plenty of hardware that still sells for real money today. The product is no longer manufactured because Logitech wanted it to be gone. The fact that Squeezebox did so well, and continues to endure despite having no corporate support, is a pretty remarkable success story, actually.

The problem with Squeezebox is that it was not consumer-friendly, not that they made a product that didn't make money. It required a server and configuration was much more difficult than SONOS. It was not for the faint at heart. The fact that they did so well even given those constraints, and even "giving away" features like soft clients, should be worth thinking about. Maybe a soft client would translate into a few lost sales, if someone is determined to dedicate a phone and a bluetooth speaker instead of buying a real SONOS device, but I bet it would translate into a lot more new customers. You still need to buy at least one speaker, and there's nothing at all I can buy to play my SONOS outside my wireless network.
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@Ryan S - thanks for the non-sarcastic feedback. "phone as zone" would be awesome. Coming from a squeezebox setup that I finally gave up on, my overall experience with SONOS is extremely good, but it's hard not to miss being able to install a client on my computer at work (or phone, whatever) and just start a play list. These days we get accustomed to the "wire walls" coming down. Having had that for so long and losing it is a difficult transition. Like I said i use subsonic + a bunch of clients to accomplish it, but it's not SONOS any more once I leave my house.
"The product is no longer manufactured because Logitech wanted it to be gone"? Well sure, they wanted it to be gone because they were losing money hand over fist, partially because it was hard to support, and partially because it was very geeky. But if you don't think a mixture of being geeky and the ability to duplicate hardware for 1/3 the price using a Raspberry Pi and Squeezesoft software didn't hasten it's demise, then you are quite naïve. Hell, the fact that it still lives on today, long after the hardware has ceased being sold, is a testament to the ability of the geeks to use the product without buying anything from Logitech. Not a very good feature set if you are looking to market a profitable brand.
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"But if you don't think a mixture of being geeky and the ability to duplicate hardware for 1/3 the price using a Raspberry Pi and Squeezesoft software didn't hasten it's demise, then you are quite naïve.

The fact that years-old Squeezebox hardware sells on Ebay today for almost as much used as it did new, should tell you otherwise.

It died because it was a pain in the butt. It required a dedicated server, and required what always seemed like near-constant maintenance. It would just not work like once a week. That's why I gave up on it once I found a way to at least access my entire music library from SONOS.

But oh, when it worked, it was amazing, and the hardware was fantastic. Sure, some people will make their own with a raspberry pi, but this is like saying that every pirated copy of Windows is a lost sale. No, in fact, every rasberry pi (with no screen, no remote control) does not represent a lost sale. Quite the opposite, it's likely that the same person paid you for at least one other device, and would never have been a customer in in the first place without such a platform. The people who build clients out of Raspberry Pi's are not the customers to worry about. They should have worried about the customers who have no interest in doing that, or mucking with servers, and so on.
We will agree to disagree about what did or did not contribute to the demise of the long dead product line you are begging Sonos to emulate. This thread, which was specifically created to announce new hardware and features of Sonos, is going far off-topic (a pattern I've seen too many times before when major Sonos releases have been announced).
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"This thread, which was specifically created to announce new hardware and features of Sonos, is going far off-topic (a pattern I've seen too many times before when major Sonos releases have been announced)"

This is just a technology problem, people want to go on tangents in discussions. Don't blame the customers, implement a feature to split threads

😉
Or maybe posters should start their own threads about which features are not being released, instead of complaining about them in a thread announcing what features are being released.
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Actually the Sonos Rep. Ryan was very respectful of your suggestion.

Indeed he was. I didn't mean to imply otherwise, just surprised that many people (not offical reps of course) would be of the opinion that a customer can be wrong to want a feature or use a service in a certiain way. Customer not always right any more in some places, I guess :)

But I am very impressed with the official response on this thread (and generally). Reading the forums and finding this kind of response was one of the reasons I finally pulled the trigger with SONOS this year instead of one of the many recent upstart competitors in the space. That and the awesome music source integration at the heart of the software, of course.
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Sorry for being thick what is HLS? And will true play work with play bar?
oh my head is already beginning to throb thinking about my squeezebox. I should take it out of the drawer and stomp on it a few more times!!

Heh. I still use an SB Radio in the bathroom vs a Play:1, for the simple reason that it has a nice clock! Haven't had LMS running for years, as the Radio works from a web server somewhere.
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I am slightly annoyed that when I ordered a Play5 just about a week or ten days ago, I was not offered the suggestion that I might want to wait for an upcoming announcement. This is my second Play5. I am perfectly happy with how they sound for where and how I use them, but still it would have been nice to know there was something coming down the pike. Theoretically I could return this second Play5 as I am within the return period, but if I wait and get a New Play5 later this year instead, then it still isn't going to actually match the first Play5 I brought on board a couple of months ago is it? Actually, the Play5 I bought recently is not exactly the same as the one I bought a couple of months ago either, the controls on the top are different.

I am old. I've been to several hundred live concerts, most of them Grateful Dead, and most without ear protection. While there is a chance I could hear the improvements in the upcoming release, there is just a good a chance that I could not. I really bought these devices to provide my elderly parents a way to easily listen to music when they want and where they want in the house, including two different sources in different rooms.

As mentioned, I can borrow an Iphone from a friend to do the True Play set up on the existing models. And if there comes a day when I have a need for big speakers again, I do still own a pair of Polk Monitor 70's that I can set back up. Though as comfortable as I am now with the Sonos devices in the house, I sincerely doubt I will ever bother with them.
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ok yea what Ryan said - he is always beating me to answering!
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Guess it was my turn to get beaten this time Chris. LHC got to it before I could :)

Oh well. Great discussion everyone. Let us know if you have any questions.
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His was a better answer too 🙂
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His was a better answer too :)

Ouch, that hurts man. I'm going to need to find some burn cream.
Those are invite only and I believe they aren't adding new people at the moment.
That's fine with me, I can wait! I did the beta thing with 5.4 and was so tired of the frequent need to upgrade by the end of it that I decided it would be my first and last venture in that direction.
So why is this new one Play:5 and not Play:6 or 4? Obviously it's a different animal, and even looks different. Would save some confusion and annoyance.